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Old 09-19-2018, 03:51 AM   #1
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Default Have you ever had to replace the "rotor" on your generator?

Do you work on your own generator? Even if you do not.. have you had any problem with the rotor and if so how many hours were on the generator?

What causes these to fail? Cummins said it was the vibration??
The whole vehicle is moving...you wouldn't think this is an issue..I don't know...
After all they're built to be used on RVs?? Correct?

My Onan Cummins LPG 2500 failed and turned out after only 30 hours ...it would not produce electricity.....I was relieved that the "stator" was fine .. only the rotor failed...

Then again...it was still a pretty expensive ordeal....

Oh well... used coach.. another thing I had to replace...at least I know the history of the RV now.....

Getting the unit serviced directly at Cummins... they should know their stuff....they said once per year for a service....

Do you agree???
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Old 09-19-2018, 04:11 PM   #2
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I have never heard of having to replace the rotor. Older generators that used brushes, are one thing. Usually changing the generator oil, cleaning the spark arrestor, changing the air filter, and other basic things are good enough.
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Old 09-19-2018, 04:59 PM   #3
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Default Okay, I see what's happening here.... could be a lack of maintenance..

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I have never heard of having to replace the rotor. Older generators that used brushes, are one thing. Usually changing the generator oil, cleaning the spark arrestor, changing the air filter, and other basic things are good enough.
Thanks for this. I purchased my 2012 RS Adventurous from a dealership ..a couple in their 60s... were turning in this 2012 with only 26,000 miles... vehicle was immaculate, only had 16 hours on the generator...... dealership said it was "amazing"....

I never even thought, from the condition and appearance, of the vehicle that they never had things like the generator serviced, but, then again, if they mostly plugged in and rarely used the generator... they probably thought ...we. don't have to service.... after all..it says first service at 50 hours...

I believe that they failed to consider the time.... what do you think about this???

I'm getting the rotor replaced it's failed and won't generate any electricity... thankfully the stator coils are all right....and with 30 hours on the clock I'm getting a full service, oil change and filter........

So much for finding a good used vehicle.... I can add this to the list of failures ...

Incidentally, do you know anyone who would normally consider this a DIY project?

They had to remove the entire system off the rig and open it up on the bench....and it took a while to diagnose the cause of the problem... not sure if was a short or what part was at fault........geez... what a freaking mess this was....

Of course you generator failed when we were on a trip and needed it most.......live and learn.

I cannot trust what other people do... disgusting.
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Old 09-19-2018, 05:11 PM   #4
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I am beginning to think you got flood vehicle that never got the title branded.



I hope they weren't just too lazy to clean the slip rings, which certainly could have been the problem.


That job is within the range of DIY if you have reasonable experience and tools. The test procedures are readily available, it appears, so diagnostics not bad, and the mechanical work is just removing and replacing parts. Probably a 4out of 5 on the DIY scale.
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Old 09-19-2018, 08:50 PM   #5
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Default Maybe that's a figure of speech?

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I am beginning to think you got flood vehicle that never got the title branded.



I hope they weren't just too lazy to clean the slip rings, which certainly could have been the problem.


That job is within the range of DIY if you have reasonable experience and tools. The test procedures are readily available, it appears, so diagnostics not bad, and the mechanical work is just removing and replacing parts. Probably a 4out of 5 on the DIY scale.
There's no flood vehicles in CA...do you mean "salvage"...the vehicle was never in any accident..it's a very clean vehicle cosmetically....

However, it's possible that the lack of maintenance for the generator due to the ultra low hours....I did see some evidence of the vehicle maintenance....and the engine is fine...

Again, people will do the bare minimum to save money.....as in ultra long or non-existent service intervals ... listen..lot of people think...it's all about the mileage and don't even pay attention to the time... I'm definitely not one of these people...

Here's some pictures of the vehicle and the original info.....it had a perfectly clean title and Carfax report.....see description at this link....

https://www.conejowholesaleauto.com/...beffb59e9eb708
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Old 09-19-2018, 09:35 PM   #6
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Titles are branded differently all over the country and getting them "scrubbed" is quite easy, it appears, so they will come up with a clean carfax. There was just one on Craigslist here that was branded "salvage, flood". Some show up as "rebuilt", etc.



The really tough ones are local vehicles that either get in an accident or get partially covered in water, perhaps in a big rain in a low spot on the road. The owner may sell them off without reporting to the insurance company, or dry it out at home or at a detail shop and sell it as if nothing happened. This happens way more often than you would suspect. Clean title all the way if that happens.


The below floor electrical and other issues you have seen are classic examples of submerged areas of vehicles, which can often take 3+ years to surface. Probably not flooded, but the symptoms would indicate it might have been, but probably only up to just above the floorboards.
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Old 09-19-2018, 09:45 PM   #7
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I repair and maintain my generator. With the right tool and patience, it is just a matter of diagnosing ang replacing parts as Booster has pointed out.

My 2010 genset now has 590 hours on its original stator and rotor. You have to exercise the generator for at least 2 hours on full load every month as per operating manual, one reason of doing this is to prevent tarnishing of slip rings. Oxidized/ dirty slip rings can cause problems including excess heat build up at the rings when it is running.

I've heard of rotor problems on older Onan genset where windings starts to delaminates from the rings.
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Old 09-19-2018, 10:11 PM   #8
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Default Not enough exercise or maintenance.....

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I repair and maintain my generator. With the right tool and patience, it is just a matter of diagnosing ang replacing parts as Booster has pointed out.

My 2010 genset now has 590 hours on its original stator and rotor. You have to exercise the generator for at least 2 hours on full load every month as per operating manual, one reason of doing this is to prevent tarnishing of slip rings. Oxidized/ dirty slip rings can cause problems including excess heat build up at the rings when it is running.

I've heard of rotor problems on older Onan genset where windings starts to delaminates from the rings.
Based upon the very few hundred...16 hours in 6 years... generator was a 2011 manufacture date and I purchased the RV in 2017... I would conclude that there's just not enough hours on the clock to justify your suggestion of running it enough to keep it maintained properly.. I don't think the RV was a salvage vehicle....

A dealership selling me a vehicle that presumably has clean title masquerading as a salvage title would be "FRAUD".....and this dealership has been in business for quite a while... They have a stellar reputation...... rather, they just took the vehicle in trade and sold it to me.... can't know the entire history....??

Look at it this way.....6 years .. that's 72 months... that's 144 hours per month .... minimum...

Again, I think what happened here is they didn't use the generator mostly plugged into shore power and concluded that they didn't really need to have it serviced... that's all.

In case you didn't see the particulars on my RV... here it is....


Sure, anything can be fixed by yourself if you know what to do....I don't have these skills.

https://www.conejowholesaleauto.com/...beffb59e9eb708
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Old 09-19-2018, 10:19 PM   #9
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Default A dealership and Craigslist is an entirely different situation

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Titles are branded differently all over the country and getting them "scrubbed" is quite easy, it appears, so they will come up with a clean carfax. There was just one on Craigslist here that was branded "salvage, flood". Some show up as "rebuilt", etc.



The really tough ones are local vehicles that either get in an accident or get partially covered in water, perhaps in a big rain in a low spot on the road. The owner may sell them off without reporting to the insurance company, or dry it out at home or at a detail shop and sell it as if nothing happened. This happens way more often than you would suspect. Clean title all the way if that happens.


The below floor electrical and other issues you have seen are classic examples of submerged areas of vehicles, which can often take 3+ years to surface. Probably not flooded, but the symptoms would indicate it might have been, but probably only up to just above the floorboards.
IF I discovered that the dealership sold me a salvage title vehicle..and pretty sure I could discover this through the California DMV... that would be major fraud......

I seriously don't think that happened......

You don't know about Craigslist or auction...and California has some pretty strict guidelines about this...once a vehicle has been labeled as a salvage title vehicle...it's not a trivial matter.....

More likely.... lack of maintenance, exercised properly and used... That's poor judgement ... not a crime.....

This was my first time purchasing an RV....if I ever do it again... I will be much better about asking questions and being suspect about this sort of thing....
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Old 09-19-2018, 10:28 PM   #10
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IF I discovered that the dealership sold me a salvage title vehicle..and pretty sure I could discover this through the California DMV... that would be major fraud......

I seriously don't think that happened......

You don't know about Craigslist or auction...and California has some pretty strict guidelines about this...once a vehicle has been labeled as a salvage title vehicle...it's not a trivial matter.....

More likely.... lack of maintenance, exercised properly and used... That's poor judgement ... not a crime.....

This was my first time purchasing an RV....if I ever do it again... I will be much better about asking questions and being suspect about this sort of thing....

You do get off track of what was said. I didn't say it would have a California salvage title, I just said it could have been flooded. Lots of vehicles that go under water up over the floors never get a salvage or flood title. I also said that titles can be scrubbed clean by reregistering in various places.


I can tell you right off, you would never be able to tell if the vehicle had been partially submerged, as even the experts have a hard time on some of them. It requires removing lots of electrical plugs and such looking for traces of water, looking inside the doors, wherever.



Flooded and dried, and even most salvage vehicles, will normally be some of the cleanest and low miles ones you will look at, so if the title didn't get branded, you wouldn't know. You might get an idea from the Carfax if there are gaps in mileage accumulation, but in an RV that would not be very accurate.


The point was, and is, and will be when I have to repeat this all again because you won't accept it, that all the under floor issues you have had would certainly fit the pattern of a vehicle that had been partially submerged. It may or may not have happened, but you can't wish or argue away the symptoms.
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Old 09-19-2018, 10:49 PM   #11
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Default OK, you know that this particular RV is from Southern California

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You do get off track of what was said. I didn't say it would have a California salvage title, I just said it could have been flooded. Lots of vehicles that go under water up over the floors never get a salvage or flood title. I also said that titles can be scrubbed clean by reregistering in various places.


I can tell you right off, you would never be able to tell if the vehicle had been partially submerged, as even the experts have a hard time on some of them. It requires removing lots of electrical plugs and such looking for traces of water, looking inside the doors, wherever.



Flooded and dried, and even most salvage vehicles, will normally be some of the cleanest and low miles ones you will look at, so if the title didn't get branded, you wouldn't know. You might get an idea from the Carfax if there are gaps in mileage accumulation, but in an RV that would not be very accurate.


The point was, and is, and will be when I have to repeat this all again because you won't accept it, that all the under floor issues you have had would certainly fit the pattern of a vehicle that had been partially submerged. It may or may not have happened, but you can't wish or argue away the symptoms.
All right, I see, but, previous owners were in their 60s apparently used this for mostly day trips to the wine country.... floods in Southern California are extremely rare events.

In any case, you're right about the problems.. maybe I should have purchased a brand new RV???
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Old 09-19-2018, 11:08 PM   #12
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Default FYI.... I found this online. no evidence of your claims.. likely just poor maintence

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You do get off track of what was said. I didn't say it would have a California salvage title, I just said it could have been flooded. Lots of vehicles that go under water up over the floors never get a salvage or flood title. I also said that titles can be scrubbed clean by reregistering in various places.


I can tell you right off, you would never be able to tell if the vehicle had been partially submerged, as even the experts have a hard time on some of them. It requires removing lots of electrical plugs and such looking for traces of water, looking inside the doors, wherever.



Flooded and dried, and even most salvage vehicles, will normally be some of the cleanest and low miles ones you will look at, so if the title didn't get branded, you wouldn't know. You might get an idea from the Carfax if there are gaps in mileage accumulation, but in an RV that would not be very accurate.


The point was, and is, and will be when I have to repeat this all again because you won't accept it, that all the under floor issues you have had would certainly fit the pattern of a vehicle that had been partially submerged. It may or may not have happened, but you can't wish or argue away the symptoms.
https://www.vehiclehistory.com/pagin...t=yes#vhodomtr
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Old 09-19-2018, 11:20 PM   #13
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That report is just like you would see for lots of vehicles, a whole bunch of "nothing reported". It doesn't really tell you anything other than that. It could have been in an accident and fixed or flooded and fixed, burned and fixed, and you would never know if it wasn't reported to the insurance company.


There are also no mileage history points in the report, so you don't know if there was a gap. No service records recorded so you don't know if it was in an are where there could have been a weather issue, etc. You get the point.


Getting a Carfax or other report that has some details of service, owners, locations, inspections, etc will at least tell you something. When I bought my 96 Roadmaster 5 years ago, the Carfax showed the two owners, repairs and mileage, registration locations, so at least I had an idea if the history "story" I was told was anywhere near correct. But, upon getting it home an in the correct lighting, I can see that the entire car had seen hail that had been repaired, very well, but repaired. Nothing on any of the reports or history.



I told you I would have to repeat it all again, didn't I?
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Old 09-19-2018, 11:35 PM   #14
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The "2 hours full load per month" rule is interesting, while it matches my experience that motors like to be used regularly, for sure the 2015 RV that I have with a total of 4 hours on the generator doesn't meet that rule. I wonder if there is an effective mean time between repairs that is measured in calendar time rather than operating hours, l like with old tires?
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Old 09-19-2018, 11:40 PM   #15
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The "2 hours full load per month" rule is interesting, while it matches my experience that motors like to be used regularly, for sure the 2015 RV that I have with a total of 4 hours on the generator doesn't meet that rule. I wonder if there is an effective mean time between repairs that is measured in calendar time rather than operating hours, l like with old tires?

While the obvious thing is gas gumming up in the carb, there are other things also like the slip ring corrosion issues. The slip rings, I think, are more environmental influenced that the other things, as they will corrode faster in damp environments, salt, etc than they would in a protected and dry area. Our Onan spent over a year in our heated crawlspace, in a big baggie and it put out over rated watts when we tested it for the guy who bought it. If it has been sitting outside in Minnesota, hanging under a van, it likely would have had issues.
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Old 09-20-2018, 12:31 AM   #16
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Default OK, so you think if I purchase the CarFax report it would tell me more?

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That report is just like you would see for lots of vehicles, a whole bunch of "nothing reported". It doesn't really tell you anything other than that. It could have been in an accident and fixed or flooded and fixed, burned and fixed, and you would never know if it wasn't reported to the insurance company.


There are also no mileage history points in the report, so you don't know if there was a gap. No service records recorded so you don't know if it was in an are where there could have been a weather issue, etc. You get the point.


Getting a Carfax or other report that has some details of service, owners, locations, inspections, etc will at least tell you something. When I bought my 96 Roadmaster 5 years ago, the Carfax showed the two owners, repairs and mileage, registration locations, so at least I had an idea if the history "story" I was told was anywhere near correct. But, upon getting it home an in the correct lighting, I can see that the entire car had seen hail that had been repaired, very well, but repaired. Nothing on any of the reports or history.



I told you I would have to repeat it all again, didn't I?
I can certainly do that... it's $24.95... you think it's worth it even now that I have the vehicle.
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Old 09-20-2018, 12:33 AM   #17
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Default Gas gumming up the carb?

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While the obvious thing is gas gumming up in the carb, there are other things also like the slip ring corrosion issues. The slip rings, I think, are more environmental influenced that the other things, as they will corrode faster in damp environments, salt, etc than they would in a protected and dry area. Our Onan spent over a year in our heated crawlspace, in a big baggie and it put out over rated watts when we tested it for the guy who bought it. If it has been sitting outside in Minnesota, hanging under a van, it likely would have had issues.
You know my generator is an LPG... and we don't get road salt in California.
We're lucky if we get enough rain.
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Old 09-20-2018, 12:39 AM   #18
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Default Four hours on your 2015 generator?

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The "2 hours full load per month" rule is interesting, while it matches my experience that motors like to be used regularly, for sure the 2015 RV that I have with a total of 4 hours on the generator doesn't meet that rule. I wonder if there is an effective mean time between repairs that is measured in calendar time rather than operating hours, l like with old tires?
Yes, that's very low like mine... you know, I had the vehicle for over a year before any generator problems.

Have you had your generator regularly serviced each year despite little to no use.

Old tires.... yeah, after they are 6 years old.. they could be a problem.
Why risk driving on old tires especially for an RV..... ?

I absolutely believe that "time" is just as important maybe more so than mileage. A higher mileage late model vehicle is certainly going to be a better bet than a 15 to 20 year old "low mileage" cream puff.
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Old 09-23-2018, 06:39 PM   #19
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Default rotor replacement

Typically rotors are replaced because of either of 2 faults: The rotor winding has grounded out internally or the generator has so many hours that the slip rings have worn to the point that they cannot be refinished. The second would be exceedingly unlikely on an RV unless it was used as an off grid home with the generator running 24/7. Grounding out can occur as a result of a winding fault or, as Booster suggested, flooding, especially if salt water is involved. If this be the case there are a multiplicity of other potential issues, of which the rotor is only the harbinger of doom.
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Old 09-28-2018, 03:50 AM   #20
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Default Alternative to buying a new rotor

The rotor on my Microlite 2800 with only 125 hours on it was bad when I bought my Xplorer, Cummins did not have one in stock at the time and it was going to be 2 months before they had another one to sell. I found this company that rebuilds them: ONAN Rotor and Stator Rewinding | Eurton Electric

I shipped them the rotor (they are in California) and the did a very professional job. Complete re-wind, new bearings, and re-balancing. If I remember correctly it took them about 2 weeks to get it back to me, and the cost was a bit more than half the price of buying a new rotor from Cummins.

These things absolutely need to be exercised for at least an hour every month, more if they live in a humid environment, to keep the slip rings clean. Otherwise they cannot generate DC voltage to power the spark plug and fuel pump. If the unit starts and keeps on running only if the starter button is held down, although there are other possible causes, more than likely it's a slip ring issue.
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