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Old 07-13-2018, 02:41 AM   #1
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Default How many of you decided getting a "new" Class B was more important than a late model?

Question; was finding a "new" Class B.. more important than a slightly used model without a warranty?


Many people are a little cautious about getting a late model even slightly used RV.. I understand..


Don't get me wrong... I thought of buying "new"... we almost did...
Then, we found the rig we ultimately purchased at a significant discount because it was a 2012 model in 2017... and it was too good to pass up..


We did have problems the first year... it was definitely a learning experience... but, people have issues with brand new ones as well.


So, we got the model we liked and could afford.. paid less money initially, and had to make some changes and upgrades, but, we didn't get killed with the instant depreciation you typically find buying a brand new RV...


What's your experience been buying new vs. used?
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Old 07-13-2018, 01:57 PM   #2
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This past year, we were moving on to our next RVing phase. This entailed going from a large Class A to a stationary 5th wheel and mobile Class B combo. While in FL, we shopped at a very large RV dealership and picked out new RVs that we both liked. Some friends at the RV park we winter at told us they were selling their newer, gently used 5th wheel (same manufacturer/make, but different model). We ended buying it, saving $40K over new.

As for the Class B, I didn't want a diesel (hence no Sprinter B), so the field became more narrow. New Chevy-based Roadtreks were out of our price range. We honed in on a new Winnebago Travato K model. We liked the floor plan with the rear bath. Because I planned to tow my small car north/south during snowbirding, I had reservations about the towing capacity of the Promaster-based Travato. We did go back to the dealer with the intent of getting the Travato, but....they just got in a used 2012 Roadtrek 190 Popular. We took it for a test drive, checked it out and liked it. We ended up buying it and saved $20K over the Travato. It was out of warranty, but during the PDI, the dealer found an intermittent inverter/charger and replaced it (they gave me the old one to tinker with). They also fixed a few minor broken things. After we took delivery of the 190P, we discovered the van was fitted with undersized tires (I've spoken of this in the past.). The dealer agreed to replace all 4 tires at their expense with ones of my choosing. So far we used the 190P for about 5K miles (towing the car about 1,700 of them) with no issues. We are very pleased with it.
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Old 07-13-2018, 03:14 PM   #3
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We bought new for a couple of reasons. first, there is the hassle of finding a good used rig - you can do it, but there's a certain amount of luck involved. People who have found good used rigs that they are still happy with a year later, usually were in the right place at the right time. I would find a rig, call the seller, get the VIN for a car fax, call the seller back to make arrangements and find it was sold. We didn't find any good options that were within 3 hours' drive but I found several that, upon inspection, had major issues.

The second reason was economics. We went to a few dealerships and found that because the US economic downturn impacted RV manufacturing, there were few used rigs for sale and the dealers were asking for prices that were as high as the rigs sold for when they were new. For example, we found a 2006 PleasureWay for $50K, a 2012 for $70K and a 2015 for $95K. And, because these were at dealerships, one had NO IDEA how they had been maintained.

So we bought a new rig for only a little more than a 5-year-old one. New engine, transmission, tires. New electrical, plumbing, cushions, batteries, propane tank, refrigerator, etc. One year and 8,500 miles later, it still seems like the right decision. Other than oil changes, we have had zero additional costs associated with maintenance, repair and upkeep.

Don't misunderstand, if I could have found what we wanted in the used market, I would have bought it, but sometimes it just doesn't work out.
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Old 07-13-2018, 03:25 PM   #4
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I doubt if we ever buy an rv new again. We have bought four new rigs over the years and a few used ones. Our story on our Roadtrek is a first! I posted this thread back about a year ago when we brought home the 2007 RT 210P.

I spent an hour at an RV show crawling over and under a new Roadtrek. I looked carefully at the plethora of new units on the market in the last few years. And we decided the quality of the new units compared to the quality of the older Roadtreks and Pleasureways was a deal breaker for passing on a new unit. Some (maybe many, maybe most) might disagree with that statement but that is our conclusion. I am talking about fit and finish, engineering, etc. We have no desire for a lot of techno super stuff on our B. Our B makes a trip an adventure, not a continuation of the technology that surrounds our lives every day at home and at my office. Just my personal observation with which few, I am sure, would be in agreement.

Our opportunity to buy our Roadtrek was unique, of course. Take a look at my posting. If not using it, I go out in the garage and give it a pat every day!!

http://www.classbforum.com/forums/f5...nest-6714.html

I do think if you are going to by used you will need to spend a lot of time looking online and be willing to travel to look at a potential purchase. I have bought units in several states over the years and was willing to do the travel. Impulse buyers will not find that approach appealing.

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Old 07-13-2018, 04:09 PM   #5
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We bought new, but only because at the time Great West was still around and they were willing to modify their standard design to our spec at a reasonable cost. Sadly, there is no longer any quality upfitter around to fill this niche. You either have to take whatever the big boys are selling, or go with a full-custom upfitter at vast expense.

I also agree with Doneworking that the fit and finish of most of what is being delivered (especially Airstream and RT) is disgraceful. It is not so much that it has it has deteriorated recently. IMO it has been bad for a long time. It is just that when you buy a lightly used vehicle, the most serious stuff has most likely been addressed by PO.

It is true that shopping used is a hassle. But, with some effort you can get an extremely good deal from an original purchaser who got in over his or her head (either financially or technically). If I were buying today, I would start by looking for almost-new.
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Old 07-13-2018, 04:29 PM   #6
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I've always bought my vehicles used and will always continue buying them used.

(never say never?!? )
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Old 07-13-2018, 05:08 PM   #7
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Default Question about RT quality????

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We bought new, but only because at the time Great West was still around and they were willing to modify their standard design to our spec at a reasonable cost. Sadly, there is no longer any quality upfitter around to fill this niche. You either have to take whatever the big boys are selling, or go with a full-custom upfitter at vast expense.

I also agree with Doneworking that the fit and finish of most of what is being delivered (especially Airstream and RT) is disgraceful. It is not so much that it has it has deteriorated recently. IMO it has been bad for a long time. It is just that when you buy a lightly used vehicle, the most serious stuff has most likely been addressed by PO.

It is true that shopping used is a hassle. But, with some effort you can get an extremely good deal from an original purchaser who got in over his or her head (either financially or technically). If I were buying today, I would start by looking for almost-new.
When you said Roadtrek quality went down recently.... what year are you talking about?
My 2012 seems pretty nice... Pictures of my RS....
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Old 07-13-2018, 05:16 PM   #8
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Default WHY did you dismiss the Sprinter?? MAINTENANCE COSTS??

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This past year, we were moving on to our next RVing phase. This entailed going from a large Class A to a stationary 5th wheel and mobile Class B combo. While in FL, we shopped at a very large RV dealership and picked out new RVs that we both liked. Some friends at the RV park we winter at told us they were selling their newer, gently used 5th wheel (same manufacturer/make, but different model). We ended buying it, saving $40K over new.

As for the Class B, I didn't want a diesel (hence no Sprinter B), so the field became more narrow. New Chevy-based Roadtreks were out of our price range. We honed in on a new Winnebago Travato K model. We liked the floor plan with the rear bath. Because I planned to tow my small car north/south during snowbirding, I had reservations about the towing capacity of the Promaster-based Travato. We did go back to the dealer with the intent of getting the Travato, but....they just got in a used 2012 Roadtrek 190 Popular. We took it for a test drive, checked it out and liked it. We ended up buying it and saved $20K over the Travato. It was out of warranty, but during the PDI, the dealer found an intermittent inverter/charger and replaced it (they gave me the old one to tinker with). They also fixed a few minor broken things. After we took delivery of the 190P, we discovered the van was fitted with undersized tires (I've spoken of this in the past.). The dealer agreed to replace all 4 tires at their expense with ones of my choosing. So far we used the 190P for about 5K miles (towing the car about 1,700 of them) with no issues. We are very pleased with it.
I imagine that you didn't want the cost associated with keeping up the maintenance on the diesel??

I don't think in the end...the cost is that different.... here's WHY....

The service intervals on the Mercedes is every 10,000 miles for oil changes and there's a lot of savings on the fuel economy.....

Plus, I love the way it drives..


The resale value of a diesel is completely different from a gasoline engine...and higher miles is usually NOT a consideration.......

Some people will probably diagree with what I have told you.....

Once you have driven the Mercedes you probably wouldn't want to go back to the Chevy....
Have you ever taken the Sprinter for a test drive????

Maybe I'm wrong....if you like the Ram Promaster or Chevy Express models.. enjoy.......
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Old 07-13-2018, 06:08 PM   #9
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I have owned quite a few RV's over about 45 years or RV'ing and to this point all have been
pre-owned - mostly travel trailers.

Every one has had a fair amount of "Issues" even the last one we had , an Airstream 30' Classic bought when three years old. Buying someone else's problems as they say!

In downsizing to a "B" I have opted to buy new for once in my life! I'm pretty sure it will be our last RV and I do understand the instant "Out the door" depreciation.

However, there comes a point that the financial consideration fades somewhat amongst other factors - we only go around once!

I'm not kidding myself that we won't have "Issues" with a brand new van, but at least I will only have the aggravation of traipsing back and forth the the dealer to have them resolved if and when we do!

Hopefully after any initial shortcomings are sorted out, we can reasonably hope for a few years with minimal problems. In buying a PW unit, I am hoping that will increase our chances!

I guess I grew up with my dad's philosophy that he would never pay someone to do what he could do himself and so I have always done my own RV maintenance and repair work in te past. These days I am getting less inclined to carry on that tradition!

Since we could not keep our trailer at home, necessary work tended to get backlogged and I would spend a good portion of our winter snowbird trips attending to all this work. My wife was not at all happy about that andI started to get a bit fed up with it too!

I doubt we will use this vehicle more than five years or so - although hope we will!

I wasn't entirely thrilled to buy the Mercedes - not so much the $$, but I was more concerned about a smaller dealer network should we have problems on the road - however
other factors caused us to go that route in the end.

I seriously considered Roadtreks, especially with their total 6 yr warranty and the fact that the factory is within an hour's drive of our home. In the end PW won our business, largely due to preferred layout & decor. and (I think) better quality reputation.

I did like the RT underhood generator / voltstart options too, and was sorry to forgo those - but now I am hearing MB have "Dismissed" RT from their certified "Master Upfitter" list and I am not sure what that is all about - could it perhaps relate to these features which I had heard MB were not really happy about?

Anyway, that is my story! Hopefully we'll be happy with our decision, and I can take it easy a bit more on our future RV trips than I have been accustomed to do. Hope I don't get bored without all the projects to work on during our trips, but I'm pretty sure I will still have some issues to deal with but with luck, not as many!

Brian
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Old 07-13-2018, 08:01 PM   #10
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Quote:
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I imagine that you didn't want the cost associated with keeping up the maintenance on the diesel??

I don't think in the end...the cost is that different.... here's WHY....

The service intervals on the Mercedes is every 10,000 miles for oil changes and there's a lot of savings on the fuel economy.....

Plus, I love the way it drives..


The resale value of a diesel is completely different from a gasoline engine...and higher miles is usually NOT a consideration.......

Some people will probably diagree with what I have told you.....

Once you have driven the Mercedes you probably wouldn't want to go back to the Chevy....
Have you ever taken the Sprinter for a test drive????

Maybe I'm wrong....if you like the Ram Promaster or Chevy Express models.. enjoy.......
I get over 16 mpg with my Chevy RT. That, coupled with the higher price of diesel in New England and Florida, pretty much negates the Sprinter's fuel "savings".

I'm somewhat concerned about the Sprinter's "reliability" that I've read about. I live in the middle of nowhere New Hampshire. It's bad enough that I have to travel 20 miles to get to the nearest RV or Chevy dealer for service. The closet Mercedes dealer is over 50 miles away and I don't even know if they would service a Sprinter-based RV.

To be honest, I've never driven a Sprinter. They're pretty much nonexistent in my neck of the woods. I moved down from a 36' gas engined Class A. Any Class B is a joy to drive in comparison to the Class A. My wife even drives the Roadtrek (when I let her!).

One thing I like about the 190P is that it's shorter and squattier than a Sprinter (20.5' x 8'-9"). It's easier to park, IMHO.
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Old 07-14-2018, 01:29 AM   #11
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I'd be more concerned about the chassis than the house as far as warranty goes. Everything in the house is relatively cheap to fix and the systems are pretty straight forward.

If it's not too old, you might be able to purchase a warranty from a warranty company - that might give you some peace of mind.

My luck with Class B's both new and old has been excellent - I have had little to no work needed - even on the 18 year old Xplorer I just had.

I would strongly recommend you avoid the Etreks and Ecotrek coaches on the used market. Many were never got to work properly, or have obsolete systems, or are due for battery replacements which could be pricey. If you are a tinkerer, and can do things yourself and understand electronics, then maybe it could be a good option for you - otherwise avoid them.
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Old 07-14-2018, 01:48 AM   #12
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I'd be more concerned about the chassis than the house as far as warranty goes. Everything in the house is relatively cheap to fix and the systems are pretty straight forward.

If it's not too old, you might be able to purchase a warranty from a warranty company - that might give you some peace of mind.

My luck with Class B's both new and old has been excellent - I have had little to no work needed - even on the 18 year old Xplorer I just had.

I would strongly recommend you avoid the Etreks and Ecotrek coaches on the used market. Many were never got to work properly, or have obsolete systems, or are due for battery replacements which could be pricey. If you are a tinkerer, and can do things yourself and understand electronics, then maybe it could be a good option for you - otherwise avoid them.
Interesting.... you know.. I didn't think about the fact that many of the 5 or 6 years old E-TREKS are going to have batteries that go bad...or have electronics issues...

That could be extremely expensive.. I see your point...
Then again..the concept is cool....

Your point makes a good argument for buying a new one and selling it before the warranty expires.
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Old 07-14-2018, 07:14 AM   #13
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I get over 16 mpg with my Chevy RT. That, coupled with the higher price of diesel in New England and Florida, pretty much negates the Sprinter's fuel "savings".

I'm somewhat concerned about the Sprinter's "reliability" that I've read about. I live in the middle of nowhere New Hampshire. It's bad enough that I have to travel 20 miles to get to the nearest RV or Chevy dealer for service. The closet Mercedes dealer is over 50 miles away and I don't even know if they would service a Sprinter-based RV.

To be honest, I've never driven a Sprinter. They're pretty much nonexistent in my neck of the woods. I moved down from a 36' gas engined Class A. Any Class B is a joy to drive in comparison to the Class A. My wife even drives the Roadtrek (when I let her!).

One thing I like about the 190P is that it's shorter and squattier than a Sprinter (20.5' x 8'-9"). It's easier to park, IMHO.
You wrote....


I'm somewhat concerned about the Sprinter's "reliability" that I've read about. I live in the middle of nowhere New Hampshire. It's bad enough that I have to travel 20 miles to get to the nearest RV or Chevy dealer for service. The closet Mercedes dealer is over 50 miles away and I don't even know if they would service a Sprinter-based RV.

That's a fair remark.....the dealership network for the Sprinter is not as good as it could be.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

To be honest, I've never driven a Sprinter. They're pretty much nonexistent in my neck of the woods. I moved down from a 36' gas engined Class A. Any Class B is a joy to drive in comparison to the Class A. My wife even drives the Roadtrek (when I let her
!

OK... I understand... I completely agree with you that the smaller Class B's are much easier t Drive and park.

We looked at the Navion and it seemed like a boat by comparison......
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Old 07-15-2018, 02:01 AM   #14
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Quote:
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When you said Roadtrek quality went down recently.... what year are you talking about?
My 2012 seems pretty nice... Pictures of my RS....
Your Roadtrek is awesome. But, I wasn't talking about design or materials, I was talking about initial build quality--fit and finish. IMO RT and Airstream are a disaster in this category, and have been for a long time.

The difference, I think, is that you bought your rig used. I suspect that most of the issues in this category were sorted under warranty or via the labor of your PO. Lucky you. By the timeI sold our 2005 Airstream Interstate, it was in perfect condition. Took a LOT of work, though.
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Old 07-15-2018, 12:43 PM   #15
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We bought used for 2 reasons, this would be our first class b, and we wanted to enjoy the RV lifestyle without breaking the bank, and I was hoping for a unit that I could maintain and repair myself if needed. Well, we ended up with a 1997 Dodge Roadtrek, paid cash for it, and so far been able to do most of the repairs myself. Parts are very easy to find, and we find that the fit and finish on these older models were really solid and well done. I know itís not as pretty as the new models, sometimes when weíre out, somebody will pull up in a really nice shiny new model, and we kinda get that envious feeling,,evertbody has different wants and needs, but for us itís been great,,,,,take care,,,,,
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Old 07-15-2018, 03:16 PM   #16
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We have had six Class Cs & Bs over a thirty-seven year period of time. Our best memories and "most fun rig" was a 1997 Roadtrek 190P on a Dodge chassis with the 318 V8 engine. It was a beautiful shade of green trim on a while van with green fabric interior. We bought it new, fully loaded, for about $43,000 as I recall. We sold it to a couple in Kansas that enjoyed it for many years before health caused them to sell it a few years ago. What a great rig!

Enjoy, peppster66!!
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Old 07-16-2018, 02:35 AM   #17
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I have less than half the cost of a high-end b-van in my Coachmen, my Super-C AND my '16 Jeep towed. My Super-C alone lost $110,000 in value from new in nine years' depreciation. My B-van lost about $70k in value in nineteen years. I DID buy the Jeep new in '16 but I bought a lifetime Chrysler warranty for it. I plan to have it a long time, and it hasn't depreciated much, and will only depreciate about 40% in ten years.

I'm not interested in the latest and greatest, I'm interested in traveling comfortably and preserving what little wealth I have to spend on travel rather than 'stuff.'

$180k in depreciation I didn't have to eat buys a LOT of repairs and a LOT of travel.
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Old 07-16-2018, 01:56 PM   #18
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You can buy a lot of fuel with two or three years depreciation expense. BUT, they have never successfully canned the new vehicle smell! Sometimes, that is a good thing. Step into a lower line new travel trailer outdoors at an RV show sometime and take a whiff. EMS is already probably at the show.

That new smell in a SUV, B or whatever has gotten less important to me with age. That, my friends, is one advantage of age: the old snorter decreases in sensitivity.

Paul
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Old 07-16-2018, 02:18 PM   #19
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You can buy a lot of fuel with two or three years depreciation expense. BUT, they have never successfully canned the new vehicle smell! Sometimes, that is a good thing. Step into a lower line new travel trailer outdoors at an RV show sometime and take a whiff. EMS is already probably at the show.

That new smell in a SUV, B or whatever has gotten less important to me with age. That, my friends, is one advantage of age: the old snorter decreases in sensitivity.

Paul
Interesting you should mention that "smell." I went to a dealership a couple of years ago on a 90* day and walked through some "inexpensive" Class C coaches... and was nearly overcome by toxic fumes from outgassing. And apparently many of the chemicals that comprise that "new car smell" are carcinogenic. Lovely, eh?
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Old 07-16-2018, 02:20 PM   #20
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.

This is all you need to make your old RV smells like new

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