New company using Dodge ProMaster van - Eko

[stanw909]

Admin Edit Jan 21, 2014: a web search turned up this link http://www.pissedconsumer.com/reviews-b ... 69246.html

-----------------------------------------------------------

http://www.eko-motorhomes.com. Lets all sing "Kum buy ya " eco friend ly.Nice looking rig for short people like me.

[stanw909]

Oh! Almost forgot. Waterless composting toilet.

[Davydd]

As with the Travato it looks as if the ProMaster's lower floor may become its Achilles heel. Once again all the tank capacities are much lower than most of the other Bs yet they are featuring and trying to market a four passenger B. That just doesn't compute. We'll find out in time. It is just not appealing to me as a two person retired touring couple. They may just be trying to reach down in the market for younger people with children--a B group I never see on the road. I'm not sure that will work even if a few thousand dollars cheaper as it is still an awfully major investment for a few weekends and a vacation or two per year.

The Ford Transit has little information yet but what little is available makes it appear as if it might be a more serious competitor with the Sprinters.

PS. We have traveled long distance twice now with grandchildren. Even with the larger Sprinters it is not easy.

[mlts22]

I actually looked into the Eko Motorhome offering a bit:

The pooper is a Nature's Head model. It is a composting toilet, and not a cassette toilet. This means that #1 goes into a bottle (dump in a park toilet or if desperate, down the shower drain, then rinse), #2 goes into a clump of peat moss and is stirred so it actually decomposes with the gases going up a vent flue. When it is 3/4 full, you dump the bucket in a trash bag, and toss it in the garbage. I wish they went with a cassette toilet just because on a boondocking trip, it is a lot easier to spend $200 on another cassette than try to deal with poop bags, pee bottles, as well as finding peat moss to keep the bacterial action going.

This is as close to a Euro-campervan as one can get in the US. The floorplan is not the Travato's "van down by the river" one as Davydd mentioned, but something actually usable with a decent bed, as well as aisle storage when one wants to get items in. The biggest differences between this and a European model is the A/C and gasoline generator (2500 watt Onan, 13,500 BTU roof A/C which is good enough for Texas weather), and 120VAC instead of 240VAC.

For me, it is as close to ideal as one can get since the rig is 20 feet, 11 inches long, and nine feet high, so it can fit in a driveway. The floorplan's only downside is that its main bed is intended for people to sleep transversely, and this may not work with taller people.

[markopolo]

Very interesting find Stan Thanks for posting the info.

[markopolo]

Is the offer on Business Opportunity for RV dealers or anyone? Anyway, it gives us an idea of pricing.

http://www.businessopportunity.com/eko-usa/

Earn $25k per month or more selling our one-of-a-kind Eko™ compact motorhome in exclusive territories nationwide. This is a fun, exciting, & profitable opportunity with a low cash investment requirement.

The all new Eko™ is a class-B motorhome designed for the perfect balance of economy, fuel-efficiency, maneuverability, and comfort. Built on the Dodge ProMaster chassis, Eko™ is incredibly quick and agile, while still offering a fully-featured RV experience.

Your Eko™ motorhome is your office and showroom. You will follow leads and drive to the customer instead of the customer coming to you. Dodge provides all after-sale servicing so no facility and associated overhead is required. This is a paid commission program so there is no inventory to purchase or carry. Best of all is you can work your own hours – Full-full time, part-time, you name it.

The only investment by the Independent Dealer is the Eko™ demo unit itself. That purchase will secure your exclusive territory. Your discounted purchase price is $69,960. You can finance your demo with 10% down. This gives you a manageable monthly payment of about $550 or less when financed for 20 years at roughly 7%.

Our factory-direct list price for the Eko™ unit is $79,500 – one of the best values in the RV industry. Your commission percentage is 12%, which equates to $9,540 in earnings per sale. The sales volume potential of this product is very high. We feel that 3 units per month will sell in each metro territory with ease based on our aggressive advertising & marketing strategies. The question is, can you sell 4, 5, or even more per month? We think so, given the growing babyboomer market, the product's competitive advantages, and its low-overhead pricing edge.

This is a realistic opportunity to make serious money. No fluff, no gimmicks … just a solid product, a solid company and an innovative sales and distribution plan. Contact us for more detailed information on this unique business opportunity.

[Davydd]

In looking at the interior photos there does not seem to be much storage. It is not clear what you can store under the two back sofas but I am betting not much. And I guess I'll never figure out why there is so much space and emphasis put on table seating inside; and once again, why two TVs?

The rear bed is definitely a cross sleep bed at 54" front to back width and 72" wide. I could sleep in 72" but would not be happy with a crawl over the other person situation. The front bed at 46" x 60" is barely adequate and only for small children about age 10-12 and under.

[bobojay]

We like the idea of 2 TV's, but again, as in the 70A ERA, the placement is wrong.

[markopolo]

For less than $80,000 it does offer above average features.
I sorted through the entire list and found the following highlights:

Corian
Two 22” flat-screen HD TVs with DVD
In-Dash GPS System
Color rearview backup camera
Waterless composting toilet
Solar power system
Auxiliary start circuit
2,000 watt 12v to 110v inverter
13,500 BTU high-efficiency roof AC
External connection point for portable gas grill
17” Styled chrome wheels
Undermount spare tire
Tow package with 7 pin wiring connector
180-amp alternator

I don't think any other builder offers all of those items as standard features.

[Mike]

Originally Posted by markopolo

For less than $80,000 it does offer above average features.
I sorted through the entire list and found the following highlights:

Corian
Two 22” flat-screen HD TVs with DVD
In-Dash GPS System
Color rearview backup camera
Waterless composting toilet
Solar power system
Auxiliary start circuit
2,000 watt 12v to 110v inverter
13,500 BTU high-efficiency roof AC
External connection point for portable gas grill
17” Styled chrome wheels
Undermount spare tire
Tow package with 7 pin wiring connector
180-amp alternator

I don't think any other builder offers all of those items as standard features.

Let's not ignore a power step, hookups for satellite, and a 13' electric awning.
As for a lowered floor inhibiting tank capacities, I don't know very many people that have ever not purchased a B because of the tank capacities. Likewise, I don't know very many people that could fill theirs to the point where it's ever been a show stopper problem, unless they've really overdone the spicy food. If your tanks fill faster than your batteries drain, there's a more serious problem, methinks.
It seems well equipped as a 2 person van, with some nice features, including the 2000W inverter and solar with a GR31 is probably decent for off griddle camping where necessary. Tack on a genset and life could be good at a remote spot.
Hey mlts22, these guys are in your backyard. How bout a recon trip north to check them out?
Overall, I like it. I would probably prefer the diesel option (more $$$?), but other than that, it looks pretty good. No GVW listed anywhere, which is a concern. How much does it weigh after conversion? Hope more converters start to produce similar rigs, at similar OTD prices.

[booster]

It does look reasonably well priced, and will appeal to a segment of the B market. I don't think it would be us, though. Don't need all the seats, but do need the storage it doesn't have. One GP31 battery, if you can't get a bunch more, means you can't run the micro off the inverter, or run anything very long. Crosswise sleeping would kill it for DW. All this doesn't make it bad, just not right for us. They are going against a lot of competition in the daytrip, soccer mom, weekender market, though, and the price may help them there.

[Mike]

I like the extra seats, personal preference I guess. 2 TVs would work for us, when bed times differ. It seems pretty well equipped overall.
One battery might be a problem, depending on the general load you place on it, but there's some solar assistance that might be expandable, as well as the battery count/capacity. And of course, there's a "backup" generator as well, to run the loads the existing coach battery setup might not handle. I agree, it's not the ideal rig for everyone, but it seems like a better starting point that could be improved upon with less effort than some existing class B options. I also like the rear aisle space for larger items like a couple of bikes, perhaps, without the need to add external carriers/mounts, but even that might be a decent option. It's set up to tow, which is interesting, considering the GVW might be pretty close to maxxed out. Then again, they say they don't use any wood in the construction, so maybe lighter weight composite materials have given them some wiggle room on towing capacity. The composting toilet might take some getting used to, operationally speaking, but so did everything else when we got started in the motorhome world.
edited for typos.

[Davydd]

If that price truly holds it will be a contender. The question would still remain in how much of a market is out there for daytrip, soccer mom, weekender market for Bs. I rarely (never?) see them on the road that way and they would be hard pressed still to beat the versatility of a small trailer or popup for that market. Conceptually, in regard to capacity of two adults and maybe two kids seated side by side behind and with those two beds it is very close to the Airstream Westfalia Sprinter that sold for a couple of years around 2005. As a first time B buyer I was kind of interested in the Westfalia but climbing up to their overhead bed was the killer for me. As I mentioned before, I will never settle for a climb over the other person bed either. My impression then with the Westfalia and my impression with this one is maybe it might appeal to an agile younger couple with small children which again begs is there a market there?

The question is is it a true price? In other words not an MSRP price everyone will assume they can get cheaper. I don't see how that price would be an inflated MSRP. For example, the Winnebago ERAs carry MSRPs over $100,000 but just about everyone has professed to have bought them in the mid to low 80s. That price is not much more than the Eko.

It does have smaller tanks all the way around which would be a show stopper for me. But the ultimate killer could be that toilet. I don't understand the composting concept. I don't understand how one can compost the waste that fast. Is it just a wag bag toilet? How does one deal with it?

Keep in mind there is one video here somewhere in Class B Forums that was referenced reviewing 15 different RVs based on this ProMaster design. There were some viable layouts that could be explored yet. This one and the Travato just don't do it for me.

[Mike]

Originally Posted by Davydd

As a first time B buyer I was kind of interested in the Westfalia but climbing up to their overhead bed was the killer for me. As I mentioned before, I will never settle for a climb over the other person bed either.

If you're farthest from the toilet, you can just open the rear door, hop out, and run around to the side door for access.

Originally Posted by Davydd

My impression then with the Westfalia and my impression with this one is maybe it might appeal to an agile younger couple with small children which again begs is there a market there?

Another puzzler. I think it's pretty safe to say that more than 2 people trying to live in a class B for more than a day, is a bit of a stretch. I can't see a family of 4 opting for one of these over the more spacious and better equipped options available. For 2 of us, it might work fine as is.

Originally Posted by Davydd

The question is is it a true price? In other words not an MSRP price everyone will assume they can get cheaper. I don't see how that price would be an inflated MSRP. For example, the Winnebago ERAs carry MSRPs over $100,000 but just about everyone has professed to have bought them in the mid to low 80s. That price is not much more than the Eko.

Good point. If it is MSRP'd at $80K, maybe it would sell for a similar discount to the Era. Might get one for a bit less than even their discounted sales person's offering price.

Originally Posted by Davydd

It does have smaller tanks all the way around which would be a show stopper for me. But the ultimate killer could be that toilet. I don't understand the composting concept. I don't understand how one can compost the waste that fast. Is it just a wag bag toilet? How does one deal with it?

The toilet puzzles me too. I guess it comes back to tank capacity and not wanting to add a black water tank to handle human waste. That would be something to consider carefully before buying. Just how easy or difficult would it be to manage? Or, could it be pulled out easily, and replaced with a porta potty? Dumping one of those might be easier than storing it and waiting for it to "process". It says "12 gallon holding tanks" (plural) in the specs, so maybe there's some flexibility in toilet options? Or they've roughed in plumbing to a common waste tank?

[stanw909]

I think the compsoting toilet is just a Greenie thing. The Greenies can dump the bags in their garden.You can throw the bags in the trash but still must pour the urine somewhere. I like my porta potti and maybe I would learn to like this as well but it is double duty and when rangers start figuring out that people are putting feces ( I think it takes more than a day or to to truly compost) in their garbage cans,they won 't be happy.

[Mike]

Seems like a "creative" and odd way to get a bag of fertilizer for the crops? Driving around for a few weeks, seeing the sights and the country, and all the time you just can't wait to get home and start planting flowers, and fruits, and vegetables, and spreading your DIY "miracle gro" on them.

[Davydd]

Originally Posted by Mike

Another puzzler. I think it's pretty safe to say that more than 2 people trying to live in a class B for more than a day, is a bit of a stretch. I can't see a family of 4 opting for one of these over the more spacious and better equipped options available. For 2 of us, it might work fine as is.

A lot of converters seem to think you can put more than two people in a B. We've traveled twice now with our grandchildren long distance and found the B rather constrained unless weather is good and you have a tent. The problem is the Eko is set up to ride and sleep four. That takes a lot of real estate in such a small B. So far, like Winnebago with its Era 70A plan they don't indicate any design flexibility for options to accommodate just two people optimally.

[bobojay]

I just don't see how their business plan is going to work as stated. That is unless they plan on selling at first to folks that don't investigate the true market price of the other Promaster B's out there. Their price to me is high compared to the Travato, and especially what the out the door Travato price will be at the aggressive dealers.
We are all putting out a lot of speculation on the EKO units, especially since no one has even seen their interiors etc, in person to evaluate the quality of the laminated "green" cabinetry.
Another opinion from me is that composting toilet has got to go.

[mlts22]

I agree with bobojay on exactly that. I've interested in this unit, except that they need to have some clear way of having service depots, so if/when the rig has its teething problems, they can be fixed swiftly.

I definitely think the composting toilet has to go. If I were exclusively boondocking, it might be OK, but I would have to keep bags of peat moss with me, or partially empty the bin to keep the stuff churning. Either way... ugh... I'm not interested in dealing with humanure, especially at a CG. A Dometic 200 cassette toilet that is mounted onto an outer rear wall of the rig with a swivel bowl would be the right answer. It isn't as easy as a black tank, but frees up the van maker to use more floorplans. Plus, I can wheel the cassette to a pit or vault toilet and let loose. The composting toilet should at least be an option, if not chucked entirely.

Of course, there are some niceties that would be cool to have, such as a built in EMS, so an undervoltage won't kill the A/C compressor, and if one accidentally plugs into 240 volts, there will be a code on the EMS display and no power as opposed to a RV fire or a barbecued electrical system.

[Mike]

I think they're exploring the market place to see what sort of response there is to a relatively (compared to most other current makes/models) inexpensive "green" class B RV. I expect their business plan is pretty simple, as stated, and they believe there's probably a niche market or sub group of "greenies" out there, that will prefer the off the grid capability and the composting toilet and the lack of dead trees used in the build. The same people that buy the Chevy Volt and the Toyota Prius, and that have composters in their backyards already, are the target audience and may be interested in these motorhomes.
Unless they've cut their margin to the bone already, they've probably based their pricing on what they already see out there, and there has to be some room to move it, or they'll go under like so many of their recent peers. Price flexibility is important these days in the business world. Wonder if they've got any federal funding to start up? Wouldn't surprise me.
Wonder how Advanced RV doing these days? Don't hear much about them any more.