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Old 08-26-2017, 03:47 PM   #601
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I am not sure why Roadtrek doesn’t have a decent battery monitoring system, could be lack of engineering, or lack of financial justification or simply a desire to keep customer at an idiot light level marketing scheme as pointed earlier.

Having a simple shunt based Victron 700 for battery monitoring for each bank should give enough information to understand the system. https://www.amazon.com/Victron-BMV-7.../dp/B00MJ9TAN8.

I am sure it is possible to design a simple system with one-meter monitoring 3 shunts. We are, as far as I know, in the 21 Century.
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Old 08-26-2017, 04:00 PM   #602
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I am not sure why Roadtrek doesn’t have a decent battery monitoring system, could be lack of engineering, or lack of financial justification or simply a desire to keep customer at an idiot light level marketing scheme as pointed earlier.

Having a simple shunt based Victron 700 for battery monitoring for each bank should give enough information to understand the system. https://www.amazon.com/Victron-BMV-7.../dp/B00MJ9TAN8.

I am sure it is possible to design a simple system with one-meter monitoring 3 shunts. We are, as far as I know, in the 21 Century.

yes -but then an owner would know how much power a battery just being on was taking. Ignorance is bliss
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Old 08-26-2017, 04:13 PM   #603
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WingedRyno would have no idea of what the remaining battery capacity is in his RV. There could be 120ah or 920ah remaining but there is no way for him to know for sure. It appears to be a challenge to even know if the batteries are charging.

Davydd mentioned the possibility of a new division at Advanced RV customizing other brand RVs - http://www.classbforum.com/forums/f7...html#post61480 - WingedRyno should try to get the first appointment and get a good battery monitoring system installed.
Advanced RV is thinking of parlaying their trained and certified installations of levelers and VB Air Suspension to others. They done some custom alterations of cabinets for other vans as well. They are considering hydro-graphics as well since they make extensive use of it on their Bs like matching dashboard components with the cabinets. That's the surface and easy stuff.

But I don't think they are contemplating fixing Roadtrek's batteries or even attempting it. Essentially I think they would have to rip out the whole installation and start over. Their Silverleaf system is integrated with every supplier of components with their custom software. They have a warp core Roadtrek taken as a trade-in and have it for sale and in the mean time I think it is part of their rental fleet. I think they've looked at it but I don't think they've torn into it find out how it works (or not). What I can glean from them is they are "mystified."
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Old 08-26-2017, 04:30 PM   #604
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When I fully charge the batteries with shore power they show 14.1 volts or so, and when shore power is removed they go down to about 13.6-13.8 volts.

So I think I have some idea of battery capacity at 13.1. I know that it's not full. I think it's safe to assume that.

I'll test it out in the next few days and see if the issue was not the GU but rather was the balmar thinking that 13.1 was not low enough to charge the battery. There is a strong possibility that is the issue.

I've loved these ecoktreks so far. They're awesome. Plenty of juice and not knowing state of charge hasn't been an issue for me whatsoever. Others may have differing opinions, but I'm loving this RoadTrek so far!
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Old 08-26-2017, 04:37 PM   #605
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I don't really see why you couldn't install a Victron battery monitor. It's just a shunt and the display module. It wouldn't control anything, but it would tell you where you are SOC wise. If you can't find a main negative lead, you could simply install one on each battery module.
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Old 08-26-2017, 04:40 PM   #606
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Advanced RV is thinking of parlaying their trained and certified installations of levelers and VB Air Suspension to others. They done some custom alterations of cabinets for other vans as well. They are considering hydro-graphics as well since they make extensive use of it on their Bs like matching dashboard components with the cabinets. That's the surface and easy stuff.

But I don't think they are contemplating fixing Roadtrek's batteries or even attempting it. Essentially I think they would have to rip out the whole installation and start over. Their Silverleaf system is integrated with every supplier of components with their custom software. They have a warp core Roadtrek taken as a trade-in and have it for sale and in the mean time I think it is part of their rental fleet. I think they've looked at it but I don't think they've torn into it find out how it works (or not). What I can glean from them is they are "mystified."
How deep is their que these days? They seem to be getting into a lot of other things when they have a significant backlog to service.
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Old 08-26-2017, 05:07 PM   #607
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How deep is their que these days? They seem to be getting into a lot of other things when they have a significant backlog to service.
I should say they are contemplating for future purposes they will announce soon. TheFitRV was a one off which evidently benefitted TheFitRV as well as Advanced RV publicity wise. TheFitRV has a longtime association with Advanced RV in that they conducted fitness seminars at past Advanced Fest.

When I was there last week they were at capacity in their existing shop in that every bay and aisle space had Bs under work and that is their bottleneck, that and balanced capacity of their work force, I think.

I was invited there for a charette meeting along with three other past customer to offer insight to their plans. I took advantage of it because I had some nagging issues I wanted to take care of before our next trip, an excuse for a breaded pork tenderloin tour (five of them), and my wife abandoning me for the week to go with our daughter and granddaughter on a trip to the Black Hills and Devil's Tower. The trip was while the height of the Sturgis motorcycle rally was going on and our daughter had longtime reservations for a hotel room and our son-in-law took a new job in the meantime and couldn't go. It just worked out.
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Old 08-26-2017, 07:17 PM   #608
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The is a good possibility that the reason we haven't seen anyone successfully put a battery monitoring system on the Ecotrek modules is the nature of the parasitic losses. If they are internal to the BMS and relays, that power would never show up on either the positive or negative cables. Without allowing for the parasitic, you state of charge would be nearly uselessly inaccurate. I think the meter would have to be altered to be able to subtract whatever the parasitic if found to be continuously whenever the module is on. Current meters can do that, but not at the large losses of the Ecotreks. Most will let you set the % loss per month, usually in the .5 to 10% per month range. On the charging side they could likely be quite accurate if done just like with other batteries, determine full from voltage and current, and then reset the meter to 100% when the charger goes off.
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Old 08-26-2017, 07:55 PM   #609
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I don’t know if it is possible on the Roadtrek systems to place a shunt between the battery plus or minus and wiring but on system like the Victron I think it could be possible. If placing a shunt on the positive post is easier than I believe that the new Blue Sea monitor can be adapted to this type of wiring with the disadvantage of lower accuracy at 4% versus 1% on the negative side. https://www.bluesea.com/products/1830/M2_DC_SoC_Monitor
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Old 08-27-2017, 12:17 AM   #610
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If the BMS is outboard of the batteries as shown in the above diagram, then installing the shunt is not all that difficult - just place it ahead of those leads to the BMS.
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Old 08-27-2017, 05:55 PM   #611
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Now this is odd. Out of the blue someone called me last night about my zion thats at the storage yard.

i let him ask me questions as he cannot find one with the side couch already on someones lot.

I said i did not have ecotreks just the standard tppl agm battery.

He then questioned how i could have solar panels. at the time i bought it solar panels were an option.

Now it seems they only give solar panels with ecotreks as a package and not an option.

i looked at the site and i don't see solars panels as a single option to get with your agm on a zion. I love my solar panels.

i'm wondering if they are forcing solar panels on ecotreks because of their use of power .

I'm sure if an agm buyer wanted it they could get it.
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Old 08-28-2017, 09:46 PM   #612
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So I confirmed that the underhood generator is not charging the batteries. I ran two last night to power the A/C while boondocking on BLM land, and then this morning with outside temp in the high 50s, I started the engine. Turned one of those two batteries on and the green light came on after a few moments with the engine running (which makes me think power is getting to them somehow...) -- the voltage was showing 12.7. It was the only battery I tried to charge and the fridge/freezer was the only load.

After an hour of driving, it showed 12.6. After a few more hours it showed 13.03. That's all because of solar I'm almost certain.

Tried calling Las Mesa in ABQ but they don't have any availability until 21 Sep. So I"ll just hit up RV parks once or twice a week and swap batteries around 13.1 volts or so in order to keep from storing them with too low a charge before I hit up an RV park and plug in to charge them up.

Balmar seems to work but I'll be fixing a permanent camera in the hood of the vehicle to start recording its performance and display.
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Old 08-29-2017, 08:30 AM   #613
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Sorry to see you still have problems. Perhaps this simple DC clamp meter can help you to troubleshoot your new van (see the picture). Fluke has one with remote display but it is 5 x more expensive. I think that using video camera to look under the hood digital display is interesting, it would be nice to have a charge current meter inside the cabin, many RVs and boats have this feature.

I suggest to install a shunt based battery(s) bank monitor(s) to fully understand you very complex system performance. Otherwise you will be facing a hit and miss style yours or dealer's troubleshooting. Shunt based battery monitors are fundamental for all battery systems.

You could get this inexpensive battery monitor (see the picture) to install on the second alternator only, at least you would know if Balmar is charging without under hood camera.
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Old 08-29-2017, 04:00 PM   #614
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Sorry to see you still have problems. Perhaps this simple DC clamp meter can help you to troubleshoot your new van (see the picture). Fluke has one with remote display but it is 5 x more expensive. I think that using video camera to look under the hood digital display is interesting, it would be nice to have a charge current meter inside the cabin, many RVs and boats have this feature.

I suggest to install a shunt based battery(s) bank monitor(s) to fully understand you very complex system performance. Otherwise you will be facing a hit and miss style yours or dealer's troubleshooting. Shunt based battery monitors are fundamental for all battery systems.

You could get this inexpensive battery monitor (see the picture) to install on the second alternator only, at least you would know if Balmar is charging without under hood camera.
Awesome idea, thanks. I'll look into that.

Looking under the rig, I think *perhaps* I've found the problem? I took a look and this blue wire was just dangling and not connected to anything. There is a brown plug on the GU that looks like it would accept the blue wire connection.

Would love it if this was the issue because I think I could fix this myself

I won't be plugging it in until I get some confirmation though.

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Old 08-29-2017, 04:26 PM   #615
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Awesome idea, thanks. I'll look into that.

Looking under the rig, I think *perhaps* I've found the problem? I took a look and this blue wire was just dangling and not connected to anything. There is a brown plug on the GU that looks like it would accept the blue wire connection.

Would love it if this was the issue because I think I could fix this myself

I won't be plugging it in until I get some confirmation though.

The blue wire provides field output to the alternator which it needs to provide suds. Looking at the regulator with the LED indicators on top, this wire should be connected to to the top vertically oriented pin on the right side of the regulator. The other end should be connected to the alternator.
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Old 08-29-2017, 04:43 PM   #616
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The blue wire provides field output to the alternator which it needs to provide suds. Looking at the regulator with the LED indicators on top, this wire should be connected to to the top vertically oriented pin on the right side of the regulator. The other end should be connected to the alternator.
So you think it's okay to plug that blue wire underneath into that brown receptacle on the alternator?

I imagine if it fits into the slot then it was designed to go there. Seems a safe bet!
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Old 08-29-2017, 04:48 PM   #617
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So you think it's okay to plug that blue wire underneath into that brown receptacle on the alternator?

I imagine if it fits into the slot then it was designed to go there. Seems a safe bet!
I would call Adam at Nations and ask him, or Lake Regions to see if the tech remembers. If you smoke it, you might have trouble getting it replaced.
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Old 08-29-2017, 05:13 PM   #618
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I would call Adam at Nations and ask him, or Lake Regions to see if the tech remembers. If you smoke it, you might have trouble getting it replaced.
Yeah I emailed the tech at Lake Regions and I'll wait to hear from him.
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Old 08-29-2017, 05:28 PM   #619
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Dealer tech got back to me and confirmed that needs to be plugged in. So will test that out when I break camp on Thursday.
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Old 08-30-2017, 01:06 AM   #620
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Actually I tested it out today. Works like a charm! Thank God for simple maintenance issues.
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