Help us decide

[rockymtnb]

Tom, since it sounds like you're a cyclist you might be interested in the Moab Skinny Tire Festival March 14-17th. Both the two day and four day events feature great scenic rides and are nice early season warmups for Ride the Rockies.

For cyclists who RV, Winnebago will be sponsoring a reception Friday evening to present new van designs and gather feedback on features needed by cyclists. LTV will host a similar event on Saturday to present their small Class C designs with internal bike storage garage.

Event registration is at skinnytireevents.com and the Winnegabo/LTV receptions can be accessed by joining the Cyclists Who RV group on Facebook and select 'Going' status on their Skinny Tire events page.

[W9TR]

Thanks - looks like a great option. The 4 day is sold out but I've e-mailed them in case they get a cancellation.

[paddy]

We decided to go with a Pleasure-Way XLMB which is a very small class C.
Shorter than some class B's
A foot wider than class B's.
Much taller than class B's
Overall just a little bigger than a larger class B.

Advantages:
More room inside.
Larger tanks for propane, fresh water, black and grey.
Much more ground clearance. Not off road but less fear of scraping the bottom.
Huge shower (know that is not important to you)(can use for storage).
Huge bathroom.
Still small enough to go almost anywhere and not need to tow a car.

[rockymtnb]

Originally Posted by W9TR

Thanks - looks like a great option. The 4 day is sold out but I've e-mailed them in case they get a cancellation.

You can also register for the 2 day ride for now and waitlist the four day. That gets you both Dead Horse Point and Colorado River route to Hittle Bottom, both of which are excellent rides. Normally I wouldn't cycle Hwy 128 due to traffic but it's been fine with the full event support day.

Then if a waitlist spot doesn't open up for Arches you can just ride on Monday as an individual park visitor for $15 entrance fee or a parks pass if you have one. NPS limits the organized group to 400 entrants but does not restrict individual visitors who ride on the same day.

Fourth day is a short ride down to Potash and back. About half the riders end up skipping that day anyway.

[Beachlife]

Originally Posted by W9TR

Kelly and I are deciding which type of Class B van we’d like to own. We'd like to lean on the group's collectiove wisdom as we decide which way to go.

There seem to be two classes of B vans - full festured ones like the Travato and Sequence that distill Class A features int a Class B chassis, and then the 'adventure vans' which are simpler.

Here are my thoughts on our use cases as a way to help us decide on features and layout.

We won’t be spending much time at full hookup RV parks. Mostly state and national parks and dispersed camping on forest service and BLM land.

We’d love everyone’s thoughts on the importance of these features.

Shower:
We’ll use the available shower house in state and national parks so no need for an indoor shower. For dispersed camping an outside shower with duck boards and/or greywater catch basin and biodegradable soap will be the ticket. Seems Class B’s have very limited fresh and grey water storage anyway so this seems to be a good compromise. It saves a lot of room on the inside of the van as well.

Toilet:
Definitely a must have for us. I’ll be the turd-herder so a cassette toilet seems to make sense as compared to a full featured grey/black water setup. Maybe an ottoman/footrest/toilet combo will work for us. Privacy is not a big issue – we’ve been married for over 30 years. ��

Kitchen:
We like to cook outside so a minimal kitchen inside will be ok in case of inclement weather. Don’t know much about the induction cooktops but seems to be a good option. Thoughts on these comparted to propane?

Pop-Top
As an ex VW Westy owner, I like the idea of a pop-top because you can keep your bed setup all the time. Maybe I’m emotionally connected to pop-tops and have a blind spot. It seems the current class of pop-top vans is less functional that the Westy's because the beds do not fold up for more headroom when you are not sleeping up there.

Awning – we camp in the desert so this is a must for us.

Generator – we have found the under-chassis generators to be very noisy. Is one really needed, apart from running the AC if you have it?

A/C – this brings a lot of complexity, is it a requirement? We will be camping mostly in the mountains and above the 45th parallel.

Thanks in advance for your thoughts!

Tom

Hello Tom, we had a travel trailer, and I am so over and done with all that crazy handling stuff. I retired and in Sept we bought the new Travato 59K Dodge RAM 3500. The Generators are all loud and the AC is also loud. The new NDQ or non duct quiet AC is better and can be set lower.. These are standard in this years new models along with the Sumo suspension. I plan to add the Sumo bump stops next year for better stability. We love the twin beds and rear toilet/wet bath. We always try to use bath houses and truck stop showers to clean up. We just joined the WIT or Winniebago club, and are attending our first get together next month (april in Daytona FL). I have found that people traveling in Class B vans love to share adventures and ideas. I have done a lot of these things to the van, but you have to think small. Space is limited but I have done some creative ideas, and share them on the blogs and with other Class B owners. Smaller appliances and less stuff. LOL is a definite. Our RV has become a bit of a hobby for me to see how we can better use items for multiple purposes. There is a Class B+ called the Wonder (Ford) with a full bath and a bit larger if you want to more. The price is also more. Going with Dodge or Ford was more comfortable for us, as the diesels just did not work for us and these dealers are all over the country and Canada (careful on who has the bay to perform service that fits). I recommend you live close to your RV Dealer, and the Vehicle Dealer that has certified pro's to work on your RV. Usually considered two separate entities. Oh make sure you have the bug screens, and black out curtains/shades and windshield/side window covers. We added window tint to the front section. I do find this RV easier to drive, park, clean, and restock when I get home. There are a ton of on line reviews and Youtube on the newer Class B's. Make sure you test drive for comfort, and do a few test runs to learn all the features once you set it up and go.
I hope this helps. I am looking forward to spring and what I call one off travels when kids are in school and avoid weekends driving. Yea Best wishes

[W9TR]

Originally Posted by Beachlife

Hello Tom, we had a travel trailer, and I am so over and done with all that crazy handling stuff. I retired and in Sept we bought the new Travato 59K Dodge RAM 3500. The Generators are all loud and the AC is also loud. The new NDQ or non duct quiet AC is better and can be set lower.. These are standard in this years new models along with the Sumo suspension. I plan to add the Sumo bump stops next year for better stability. We love the twin beds and rear toilet/wet bath. We always try to use bath houses and truck stop showers to clean up. We just joined the WIT or Winniebago club, and are attending our first get together next month (april in Daytona FL). I have found that people traveling in Class B vans love to share adventures and ideas. I have done a lot of these things to the van, but you have to think small. Space is limited but I have done some creative ideas, and share them on the blogs and with other Class B owners. Smaller appliances and less stuff. LOL is a definite. Our RV has become a bit of a hobby for me to see how we can better use items for multiple purposes. There is a Class B+ called the Wonder (Ford) with a full bath and a bit larger if you want to more. The price is also more. Going with Dodge or Ford was more comfortable for us, as the diesels just did not work for us and these dealers are all over the country and Canada (careful on who has the bay to perform service that fits). I recommend you live close to your RV Dealer, and the Vehicle Dealer that has certified pro's to work on your RV. Usually considered two separate entities. Oh make sure you have the bug screens, and black out curtains/shades and windshield/side window covers. We added window tint to the front section. I do find this RV easier to drive, park, clean, and restock when I get home. There are a ton of on line reviews and Youtube on the newer Class B's. Make sure you test drive for comfort, and do a few test runs to learn all the features once you set it up and go.
I hope this helps. I am looking forward to spring and what I call one off travels when kids are in school and avoid weekends driving. Yea Best wishes

I hear you on the trailer towing. We owned a folding tent trailer and have rented several trailers, the last being an Airstream 23'. It was top shelf but I've found I just don't like towing anything, so Class B will be the sweet spot for us.

You've picked a great rig with a popular floor plan. If imitation is the best form of flattery the Travato wins hands down. We are refining our thinking about what's important to us and this group has been super helpful.

We don't live at the edge of civilization but you can see it from our deck. The closest RV dealer is a 5 hour round trip drive from our home. So that's why we are looking at Dodge, Ford, and Chevy vans as we can get them serviced locally. Support is critical for us, but my take is I will be doing most of the work on whatever we buy.

Thanks for the info on screens - a must for us as we spend a lot of the summer in Northern Wisconsin where the skeeters can be intense.

Tom

[W9TR]

Originally Posted by rockymtnb

You can also register for the 2 day ride for now and waitlist the four day. That gets you both Dead Horse Point and Colorado River route to Hittle Bottom, both of which are excellent rides. Normally I wouldn't cycle Hwy 128 due to traffic but it's been fine with the full event support day.

Then if a waitlist spot doesn't open up for Arches you can just ride on Monday as an individual park visitor for $15 entrance fee or a parks pass if you have one. NPS limits the organized group to 400 entrants but does not restrict individual visitors who ride on the same day.

Fourth day is a short ride down to Potash and back. About half the riders end up skipping that day anyway.

Thanks for the tip. Awesome! I am rounding up some pals to ride with.

Tom

[W9TR]

We have refined our thinking a bit with the help from everyone on this thread and a lot of research.

Having a pop-up is now a 'must have'. This is admittedly an emotional decision buy hey I think it is a really fun option.

Having separate sleeping and living quarters to the extent possible in a B van has floated to the top.

We are less 'hard over' on a rear bath as that seems to be an either/or with a big bed in back. The bed wins as we will be spending 8 hours in bed and 8 minutes in the bath.

We are still weighing the simplicity / complexity argument so have a few vans to look at:

PleasureWay Tofino - doesn't get any simpler, love the concept. I'm a little worried about the lack of standup height and fresh/grey water capacity but this could be a daily driver (with benefits!) Still #1.

Hymer AKTIV Loft - this one has hair all over it due to the HGNA business failure and subsequent warranty issues. But we like the layout, there seems to be lots of online support, and I am a DIY person at heart. The shower setup seems poorly designed. Don't like the UHG/Lithium implementation either but there are workarounds.

Thor Tellaro 20AT - the longest and arguably most complex van we are looking at. The rear bed is big and there is a social area up front where 4 people can hang out. We like the grandkid jump seats with three point seatbelts. Don't like the cabinets (no positive locks), genset and AC options, though. Looks to be very similar to the Hymer Aktiv.

Winnebago Solis- another fine van, very similar floor plan to the Hymer Aktiv.

So that's where we stand. We will be looking at these choices and potentially others over the next several weeks.

Tom

[LostInWoods]

Originally Posted by W9TR

We have refined our thinking a bit [...]

Thor Tellaro 20AT - [...] Don't like the cabinets (no positive locks), genset and AC options, though. Looks to be very similar to the Hymer Aktiv.

Winnebago Solis- another fine van, very similar floor plan to the Hymer Aktiv.

Tom

My wife and I were both very impressed with the Tellaro 20AT pop-top at the Tampa show. The added headroom really opened up the cabin, even if you don't use the upstairs bedroom. The layout with rear bed & garage underneath plus the front lounge area should work well for us. Downsides that I noted are the cheap cabinet build (staples, ugh), rather flimsy table due to no support leg (tradeoffs), and a really short bathroom that I (at 5'10") could not fully stand up in. Also the low point under the chassis seemed to be the propane fixtures on the driver's side, such that I think there less than 6" of ground clearance, though I didn't measure.

Solis was a similar layout to the Tellaro AT with better build quality IMO, but it does not have A/C, which is killer to us in the southeast. As I recall the Tellaro lounge seats (with seatbelts) were more comfortable than the Solis. Much of this is subjective so I highly recommend that you look at both.

Due to the lack of A/C and shower we only glanced at the Tofino, but PW build quality is really good.

[Jon in AZ]

Originally Posted by W9TR

We are less 'hard over' on a rear bath as that seems to be an either/or with a big bed in back. The bed wins as we will be spending 8 hours in bed and 8 minutes in the bath

My wife loves to sit and read on the big rear bed with the back doors open wide to the view during the day as well. It's her favorite spot in our camper. The full screen is wonderful.

[BBB]

For boondocking, lithium’s are a must for us. In our 2019 Lexor TS, they power my wife’s CPAC and Fanastic fan. The temperature controlled fan along with PW’s awning windows negate the need for AC on most nights, even rainy ones. And the generator is always there if we need it.

[W9TR]

Originally Posted by LostInWoods

My wife and I were both very impressed with the Tellaro 20AT pop-top at the Tampa show. The added headroom really opened up the cabin, even if you don't use the upstairs bedroom. The layout with rear bed & garage underneath plus the front lounge area should work well for us. Downsides that I noted are the cheap cabinet build (staples, ugh), rather flimsy table due to no support leg (tradeoffs), and a really short bathroom that I (at 5'10") could not fully stand up in. Also the low point under the chassis seemed to be the propane fixtures on the driver's side, such that I think there less than 6" of ground clearance, though I didn't measure.

Solis was a similar layout to the Tellaro AT with better build quality IMO, but it does not have A/C, which is killer to us in the southeast. As I recall the Tellaro lounge seats (with seatbelts) were more comfortable than the Solis. Much of this is subjective so I highly recommend that you look at both.

Due to the lack of A/C and shower we only glanced at the Tofino, but PW build quality is really good.

We are going to look at a TellaroAT tomorrow. Thor made some interesting choices on this van. It has only a 1000W inverter which means I won't be able to make toast or run the microwave without turning on the generator. The inverter will run a coffee pot and the TV, and that's about it. In a little concerned about not haivng openable windows in the rear of the van, but some Thor B vans have added back windows. That said, there are a lot of practical features and we do like the layout so this should be a fun trip.

[W9TR]

Originally Posted by BBB

For boondocking, lithium’s are a must for us. In our 2019 Lexor TS, they power my wife’s CPAC and Fanastic fan. The temperature controlled fan along with PW’s awning windows negate the need for AC on most nights, even rainy ones. And the generator is always there if we need it.

We are looking at some vans with Lithium batteries and under hood generators. 400AH of Lithium would run whatever we needed for boondocking for several days, so we are biased in this direction. The onboard gensets seem pretty noisy to us so we are trying to avoid them.

[GeorgeRa]

Originally Posted by W9TR

We are going to look at a TellaroAT tomorrow. Thor made some interesting choices on this van. It has only a 1000W inverter which means I won't be able to make toast or run the microwave without turning on the generator. The inverter will run a coffee pot and the TV, and that's about it. In a little concerned about not haivng openable windows in the rear of the van, but some Thor B vans have added back windows. That said, there are a lot of practical features and we do like the layout so this should be a fun trip.

We all have different needs, my experience with Magnum 1000W inverter drove me to install the second inverter, a very efficient 300W Morningstar which became our primary unit. We can run our 600W microwave with Magnum but we don’t use it often. The 300W unit runs 2 independent from Magnum/Shore outlets.

Li batteries have some limitation for storage and charging in low temperature which could impact your off-season storage requirements or winter camping.

[rboegh]

Tom,

Sounds like us.... we had/have a VW Westy, but wanted to go farther, faster, and with more comfort! After reviewing what was out there in late 2018 we went with a Hymer-Carado-Banff.... great little rig on 2500 Promaster, with Lith Batts, solar, underhood GU, full usable bath, everything you need in an open floorplan with a price tag new of $63K! WE love it and have put over 20K on ours. Now read on them and Hymer NA is gone, but there are still some 2019's and used out there. Also you can find a Axion (18' with loft) in Bozman MT, on RV Trader.com by typing in Axion.... asking under $90K and there are still a few Aktiv-Lofts out there new in same price range.

Good luck and See you on the Hi-ways!

[Twinbridges]

There are many options. Five years with a B and 50,000 miles, a few importants for me. For Boondocking, which is most of the time, at least 600 ah of lithium.
Can live for 3 1/2 days with no electric worries. And they recharge quickLy. Add as much solar as you have room for.

A real indoor bath/toilet is so convenient. With a mascerator emptying is a easy, quick, and no mess or big hoses to wrestle with.

We adapted from Dayyid the articulating beds which are great for lounging and easy to make flat for sleeping. The aisle makes it easy for each to get up and down. We changed out an electric sofa for two tempurpedic (sp?) singles.

[NFRicaS]

Originally Posted by GallenH

My 2 cents. I have an old PleasureWay B. We leave it set up as twin beds and have quilts on as bedspreads. At bedtime we don't need to make up a bed. It's there. In the morning we don't have to tear things apart. Just make the beds up. A table for eating,if we eat inside, goes between but we often eat breakfast just using the nightstand surface between the beds to set things on. At my ancient vintage I get up at night to use the bathroom 2-3x. So having a compartment bathroom is perfect for us. I've never "showered" in the bath but I have taken Navy showers where I wash from the top of my head to my toes. I've had the RV for about 4 years. I do a Navy shower EVERY morning. Never missed one day.

Having said all that, I would suggest that you look into renting a few different Bs. See how you like the setup of different floorplans and if you're ok with a cassette toilet.

If I were to now buy a new RV, I'd look for the things that I have grown used to in our old one. Twin beds. Bath, etc. So maybe renting would give you some better idea as well.

I’m almost the same..older B...twins left up, but one side extended out to table legs (36”) other side used as a desk/eating area..yes to the bathroom 2-3 times a night...no navy shower, but an older B is just a good deal... love mine...

[W9TR]

Originally Posted by rboegh

Tom,

Sounds like us.... we had/have a VW Westy, but wanted to go farther, faster, and with more comfort! After reviewing what was out there in late 2018 we went with a Hymer-Carado-Banff.... great little rig on 2500 Promaster, with Lith Batts, solar, underhood GU, full usable bath, everything you need in an open floorplan with a price tag new of $63K! WE love it and have put over 20K on ours. Now read on them and Hymer NA is gone, but there are still some 2019's and used out there. Also you can find a Axion (18' with loft) in Bozman MT, on RV Trader.com by typing in Axion.... asking under $90K and there are still a few Aktiv-Lofts out there new in same price range.

Good luck and See you on the Hi-ways!

Glad to see you are enjoying your Carado Banff.
I saw the listing for the Axion Studio in Bozeman.

We are going to look at a Hymer Aktiv Loft in a few weeks. It seems to be a good layout.

There is a rental place in Vegas that has several used Aktiv Lofts for sale. I'm a little leery of buying something that complex that has been operated by people not familiar with all the systems.

[W9TR]

Originally Posted by GeorgeRa

We all have different needs, my experience with Magnum 1000W inverter drove me to install the second inverter, a very efficient 300W Morningstar which became our primary unit. We can run our 600W microwave with Magnum but we don’t use it often. The 300W unit runs 2 independent from Magnum/Shore outlets.

Li batteries have some limitation for storage and charging in low temperature which could impact your off-season storage requirements or winter camping.

A lot of the bigger inverters have high quiescent current draw (4A-6A) so it just makes sense to add something more tailored to your loads.

[W9TR]

Originally Posted by Twinbridges

There are many options. Five years with a B and 50,000 miles, a few importants for me. For Boondocking, which is most of the time, at least 600 ah of lithium.
Can live for 3 1/2 days with no electric worries. And they recharge quickLy. Add as much solar as you have room for.

A real indoor bath/toilet is so convenient. With a mascerator emptying is a easy, quick, and no mess or big hoses to wrestle with.

We adapted from Dayyid the articulating beds which are great for lounging and easy to make flat for sleeping. The aisle makes it easy for each to get up and down. We changed out an electric sofa for two tempurpedic (sp?) singles.

Thanks for your feedback on the indoor bath. This is one of the things we say we can do without, but I'm starting to think a small one would be better than an outside shower and a cassette toilet in an ottoman. The vans we are looking at all have cassette toilets (or none in the case of the Tofino). I've used cassette and regular black water setups. There are pros and cons to any of these toilet systems. Since I am the official family turd-herder I will have to live with any decision we make.