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Old 12-03-2014, 06:21 PM   #61
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

One thing I do is camp at renaissance faires, so there isn't any electric power, but after late March and before mid-October here in this area of Texas, the A/C is needed to remove humidity out of the air. For most people, running the vehicle's motor is fine, especially in northern climates, so it is understandable why RT decided to go this route.

The lack of a generator is not an intractable problem, especially if everything else on the van is good. A Honda EU2000i generator mounted on a swing-away bracket would be an answer to this.
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Old 12-03-2014, 06:38 PM   #62
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

Quote:
Originally Posted by gerrym51
other than the 170 all models currently get 6 volt combinations. if he is talking about the normal 1/2 trek package it's 4 6 volt batteries that have a total of 220 12 volt amps.he has said that things are different on this from other roadtreks so i could be wrong.

I am still holding out hope that i can get the 360 amp lithium package that they showed in prior video

still need more info.
I think all the models with two 6 volt batteries have 220AH batteries at 6v, which would give 220AH at 12v. If they use 4, I would expect them to have 440AH at 12v, which lines up with the 1/2 etrek as an etrek has about 800AH at 12v IIRC. Roadtrek advertises it at 1600AH, but that is at 6v. If the lithium package is 360AH at 12v, it is below a 1/2 etrek, but it is more usable, if you don't want to go under 50% an the AGMs.

There is a lot of specmanship going on, I fear. Pleasure-way and Roadtrek, and maybe others have started to include the water heater capacity in their fresh water "capacity" even though you can't use it. No more "tank size" with them, which is what you can actually use.
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Old 12-03-2014, 06:43 PM   #63
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

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Originally Posted by booster
Quote:
Originally Posted by gerrym51
other than the 170 all models currently get 6 volt combinations. if he is talking about the normal 1/2 trek package it's 4 6 volt batteries that have a total of 220 12 volt amps.he has said that things are different on this from other roadtreks so i could be wrong.

I am still holding out hope that i can get the 360 amp lithium package that they showed in prior video

still need more info.
I think all the models with two 6 volt batteries have 220AH batteries at 6v, which would give 220AH at 12v. If they use 4, I would expect them to have 440AH at 12v, which lines up with the 1/2 etrek as an etrek has about 800AH at 12v IIRC. Roadtrek advertises it at 1600AH, but that is at 6v. If the lithium package is 360AH at 12v, it is below a 1/2 etrek, but it is more usable, if you don't want to go under 50% an the AGMs.

There is a lot of specmanship going on, I fear. Pleasure-way and Roadtrek, and maybe others have started to include the water heater capacity in their fresh water "capacity" even though you can't use it. No more "tank size" with them, which is what you can actually use.
Booster-you are of course correct. I knew this but am suffering from battery overload
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Old 12-03-2014, 10:03 PM   #64
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

I wish the video showed bicycles stored down the center aisle (you can see the bikes at the back of the shot behind the van.) It doesn't really look all that wide.

I like a lot about this design, but I'm still partial to the Safari Condo Flex layout, especially for its additional seating area/"living room" up front.
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Old 12-03-2014, 10:08 PM   #65
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

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Originally Posted by mutcth
I wish the video showed bicycles stored down the center aisle (you can see the bikes at the back of the shot behind the van.) It doesn't really look all that wide.

I like a lot about this design, but I'm still partial to the Safari Condo Flex layout, especially for its additional seating area/"living room" up front.

29 inches
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Old 12-03-2014, 10:39 PM   #66
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

There is a lot to like here.

If you can run the AC off the inverter going down the road, as he said, then I can only assume you could do the same thing idling the engine for a lunch stop-over, or to keep the coach cool for the dog while you pop into the grocery. If that is the case, then I could certainly get by without an Onan. For boon docking, I could always opt to carry a portable generator for longer AC use.

If the refer is a three way, the water heater is gas, and the battery bank is really 400 AH 12v, then you could stay out for quite a while. If it's all 12v appliances, then maybe 3 days.

I don't like the look of the cabinetry. I like the curved and glossy look you see in many these days. Also don't care for the white laminate - looks cheap, but I'd be certain you'll have a couple color schemes to choose from.

The power sofa seems silly, I'd opt out on that. At least you have some cargo access for bikes, etc. I'd have rather seen the beds flip up against the walls to create a big cargo area.

Would like to see the bath though. Looks pretty narrow from the video.
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Old 12-03-2014, 10:43 PM   #67
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

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I'd have rather seen the beds flip up against the walls to create a big cargo area.
Yep. Wife went "ooooh" when she saw the flip-up bed in the Travato we looked at on Black Friday. (But, having a corner bed in our 23' Airstream, we're swearing off that design in the next RV.)
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Old 12-03-2014, 10:50 PM   #68
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

Oh, did you notice from the placard here,

http://roadtreking.com/010-roadtreki...s-b-motorhome/

It show the front end from the 2015 Ducato? The new, more attractive front end must be in the pipeline for North America.
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Old 12-03-2014, 11:11 PM   #69
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

Specs:

Exterior length – 20’11”
Exterior width – 6? 11?
Interior aisle width – 29?
Exterior height – 9? 5?
Interior standing height – 6? 2?
Wheelbase – 159?
Gross vehicle weight rating – 9,350 pounds
Occupant and cargo carrying capacity – 1,250 pounds
Gross combined weight rating – 11,500 pounds
Fuel type – Gas 24 US gal
Fresh water capacity – 35 US gal
Black holding tank capacity – 19 US gal
Gray holding tank capacity – 20 US gal
Rear king sleeping max width and length – 74?”x 76?

Wow. Tanks AND batteries. Maybe I've found my unicorn.
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Old 12-03-2014, 11:27 PM   #70
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

Quote:
Originally Posted by wincrasher
There is a lot to like here.

If you can run the AC off the inverter going down the road, as he said, then I can only assume you could do the same thing idling the engine for a lunch stop-over, or to keep the coach cool for the dog while you pop into the grocery. If that is the case, then I could certainly get by without an Onan. For boon docking, I could always opt to carry a portable generator for longer AC use.

If the refer is a three way, the water heater is gas, and the battery bank is really 400 AH 12v, then you could stay out for quite a while. If it's all 12v appliances, then maybe 3 days.

I don't like the look of the cabinetry. I like the curved and glossy look you see in many these days. Also don't care for the white laminate - looks cheap, but I'd be certain you'll have a couple color schemes to choose from.

The power sofa seems silly, I'd opt out on that. At least you have some cargo access for bikes, etc. I'd have rather seen the beds flip up against the walls to create a big cargo area.

Would like to see the bath though. Looks pretty narrow from the video.

refrigerator is 12 volt compressor
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Old 12-04-2014, 12:04 AM   #71
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

If there is 29" between those beds when folded up then you can easily store two bikes as the early video showed. Advanced RV parks two bikes inside in the back crosswise with hold downs in a space of about 16".

With that set up if truly 400 ah at 12v and 200 watts solar I would venture to say you can stay out indefinitely not hooked up to shore power if not using air conditioning. I think I figured that out in my Advancing Alvar thread here. Besides Bs are meant to be driven and used even when staying in one location and the large engine alternator is going to recharge those batteries pretty fast. If they do turn out to be lithium ion then it is all a no-brainer in my opinion.
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Old 12-04-2014, 01:11 AM   #72
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

The only thing that gives me trepidation is the quoted 1250 lbs of cargo capacity. That most certainly leads me to believe that, in addition to the more plentiful cabinetry, they are using 4 Group 31 AGM batteries. I'd also think that 200watts of solar is kinda light and there should be plenty of room on that roof for more than that.

So far, this appears to be the heaviest Promaster we've seen to date.
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Old 12-04-2014, 01:32 AM   #73
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

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The only thing that gives me trepidation is the quoted 1250 lbs of cargo capacity. That most certainly leads me to believe that, in addition to the more plentiful cabinetry, they are using 4 Group 31 AGM batteries. I'd also think that 200watts of solar is kinda light and there should be plenty of room on that roof for more than that.

So far, this appears to be the heaviest Promaster we've seen to date.

for once we agree on something. however we still don't know many specs from roadtrek.it doesn't have the onan so it must be heavier with things we don't know.

propane tank, etc. Jim Hammill originally said 1500 pounds which leads me to believe there will be lithium option.
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Old 12-04-2014, 01:38 AM   #74
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

I believe Booster has 240 watts of solar on his Roadtrek. He might be able to address the solar better than anyone here. After I went through all my gyrations I came to the conclusion that with our second alternator and frequent driving that solar was mostly frosting. If it would make up most of the difference of the power usage of a compressor refrigerator running all the time I would be happy. But then I have no experience with photovoltaic solar. I will know more by next spring.

Four group 31 AGM batteries would weigh about 270 lbs. + or -. That would be about 150 lb. premium over lithium ion.
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Old 12-04-2014, 01:49 AM   #75
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

I would think that 2 - 160 watt panels would fit giving a total of 320 watts. Unless they are using a fairing or rail system to support the panels that is designed for a couple 100watt panels. Since there is no TV antenna up front hogging roof space like on the Travato, there is a very large, wide space for panels on the Promaster, even if they have the AC and the roof vent in the same places.

But I agree, any solar is just additional redundancy. But I'm often in places where I don't want to disturb my Zen for a few days, so it's nice to have.
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Old 12-04-2014, 01:53 AM   #76
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

Quote:
Originally Posted by gerrym51
Quote:
Originally Posted by wincrasher
The only thing that gives me trepidation is the quoted 1250 lbs of cargo capacity. That most certainly leads me to believe that, in addition to the more plentiful cabinetry, they are using 4 Group 31 AGM batteries. I'd also think that 200watts of solar is kinda light and there should be plenty of room on that roof for more than that.

So far, this appears to be the heaviest Promaster we've seen to date.

for once we agree on something. however we still don't know many specs from roadtrek.it doesn't have the onan so it must be heavier with things we don't know.

propane tank, etc. Jim Hammill originally said 1500 pounds which leads me to believe there will be lithium option.
It could very well be how they are counting. I really expected it to be the lightest van, considering the smaller fridge and no Onan. Bonus would be if they are using the same heater/water heater that Winnebago is migrating to. Maybe they are including full tanks in the weight?
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Old 12-04-2014, 02:04 AM   #77
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

Quote:
Originally Posted by wincrasher
Quote:
Originally Posted by gerrym51
Quote:
Originally Posted by wincrasher
The only thing that gives me trepidation is the quoted 1250 lbs of cargo capacity. That most certainly leads me to believe that, in addition to the more plentiful cabinetry, they are using 4 Group 31 AGM batteries. I'd also think that 200watts of solar is kinda light and there should be plenty of room on that roof for more than that.

So far, this appears to be the heaviest Promaster we've seen to date.

for once we agree on something. however we still don't know many specs from roadtrek.it doesn't have the onan so it must be heavier with things we don't know.

propane tank, etc. Jim Hammill originally said 1500 pounds which leads me to believe there will be lithium option.
It could very well be how they are counting. I really expected it to be the lightest van, considering the smaller fridge and no Onan. Bonus would be if they are using the same heater/water heater that Winnebago is migrating to. Maybe they are including full tanks in the weight?

i do know it's suburban furnace and water heater. the side cutouts for the vents are for each of these-i do not know the size of the propane tank
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Old 12-04-2014, 12:47 PM   #78
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

Quote:
Originally Posted by wincrasher
I would think that 2 - 160 watt panels would fit giving a total of 320 watts. Unless they are using a fairing or rail system to support the panels that is designed for a couple 100watt panels. Since there is no TV antenna up front hogging roof space like on the Travato, there is a very large, wide space for panels on the Promaster, even if they have the AC and the roof vent in the same places.

But I agree, any solar is just additional redundancy. But I'm often in places where I don't want to disturb my Zen for a few days, so it's nice to have.
We kind of agreed about the redundancy frosting as we both put it. We have to remember Roadtrek is deliberately trying to market the Zion as a low cost solution yet has to market the appeal of solar for what I see as their Millennial generation active customer very interested in that stuff. Even the name Zion evokes active adventure. Cost is the governing factor.

Millennials, not the Baby Boomers appears to be the Promaster converter's target market evidenced also by that Winnebago Travato 59K decked out with kayak and bikes. Than van has to be more multifunctional in everyday use rather than a tourer for a retired couple such as would appeal to me. Also, it may be better for short term travel use simply by the fact it is more than 3 feet shorter than an extended body Sprinter and gives up a lot of storage volume and payload in comparison. Short term is OK with a Millennial who is more likely still working and only gets weekends and short vacations.
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Old 12-04-2014, 01:45 PM   #79
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

Agree with your points. I'd say the sports-active market is a bit wider. Probably up to age 60, which includes a few boomers.

The thing with us younger boomers and the millenials (or is it GenX, Y, I forget all the terms)? Is they love the gadgets and want connectivity.

I'm in the process of replacing my 5th wheel trailer I use in my work. The options list includes fairly extensive list of solar, inverters, wifi extenders, cell repeaters, etc. Not to mention all the audio/video options.

I'm curious to see Roadtrek's options list. I imagine the $82k van he is quoting is with minimal options. All their other vans, even the Chevy's, can easily top $100k with all the goodies available. Who knows, maybe 200 watts is the minimum solar config?
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Old 12-04-2014, 02:43 PM   #80
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

Although everyone likes lots of storage; perhaps the name should be changed to " The Carlsbad " because it looks real cave like inside.
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