RoadTrek's EcoTrek

[Davydd]

Originally Posted by gerrym51

does this mean they are making 6 volt battery packs? just wondering

Most all lithium ion batteries we are concerned with are 3.2V cells with varying amp hour ratings. More than likely the individual batteries are 200ah 3.2V cells with 4 wired in series to create a nominal 12V battery. 32 cells would give you 8 200ah 12V batteries wired parallel to each other to produce 1600ah 12V output.

I have 16 200ah 3.2V cells for a total of 800ah.

[Boxster1971]

Davydd has it right - I should have been clearer. Today Jim Hammill posted on FB that Campskunk's batteries are 800 AH lithiums.

[Davydd]

Originally Posted by Boxster1971

Davydd has it right - I should have been clearer. Today Jim Hammill posted on FB that Campskunk's batteries are 800 AH lithiums.

That should be enough. Campskunk claims to be a weather follower so probably wasn't interested in capacity for air conditioning. Also saw Mike Wendland say neither he or Campskunk had the Voltrek auto starting feature.

[markopolo]

Originally Posted by Davydd

BobB,

I have exhaustively given a "real world data" analysis in my Advancing Alvar thread with an 800ah lithium battery pack and 420w solar and second alternator. My Advanced RV is similar to what Roadtrek is attempting with their EcoTrek concept. Roadtrek has historically exaggerated their numbers most likely to a theoretical lab max, and its two proponents with lithium battery Bs on the road have revealed little other than platitudes and generalities.

You can estimate fairly realistically how much air conditioning you can use. It is a paradox. Don't listen to it runs only part of the time. If it is too hot to absolutely need air conditioning the air conditioning is going to run most of the time typically at about a rate of 125 amp hours depleted from your battery bank per hour. MarkoPolo has estimated fairly close but I would use his lower number of hours. What people tend to discount in calculations are you also are depleting your batteries with all your other electrical requirements. So, if you think you are going to go through the night and all day with air conditioning you might come close with the 1600ah battery bank. But then it is a depletion game. Sit running the engine generator all day too to recharge? Keep your B totally closed all day? That's no fun in a campground.

Roadtrek will have 600w of solar with their maximum configuration. That contributes to longevity running off the batteries with fortunate luck if you have sun but will never restore the energy used so it is an eventual depletion game.

A 400ah - 800ah battery bank is not going to give you air conditioning satisfaction at least what you desire. It will be fine for short period of times as people have expressed desiring to walk away with pets inside. Personally I am more confident in opening up all my window vents and running a fan. In a campground I prefer opening up the back doors and sliding door and relying on screens. I also just follow the optimum weather 95% of the time. Lastly, when push comes to shove and you are sweating and dying, seek shore power. It is that simple for me.

Davydd suggested that the A/C runtime estimates I previously posted might be too high and it looks like he's right.

Here are a couple of quotes from Jim H on Facebook:

https://www.facebook.com/groups/roadtreking/permalink/480653322093652/?comment_id=480747935417524&offset=0&total_comment s=60&comment_tracking={%22tn%22%3A%22R9%22}

On AC, if you buy an engine Genny and the larger inverter comes with it, and you have EcoTrek 400' then 2.5 to 3 hours of AC in 90 degree temperature will likely be the norm, if the batteries are in a full SOC (90% +). If it's hotter then less. If it's colder then more.

and

Those are ballpark numbers and depend on the number of people in the unit. Inside starting temp, outside starting temp. Windows closed tight and curtains closed. Reflect is window covers help a lot.

Consider it a rough guideline of what to expect. We'll know more when people start buying the EcoTrek packages and reporting results.

[booster]

I think a lot the numbers will be influenced a bunch by how all the different models will be equipped beyond the Ecotrek stuff.

If they are full on electric models like Davydd's, using 200-300ah per day without air conditioning, the AC run time is going to be whole lot less than on a more power saving propane/12v based model that might be under a 100ah a day without air conditioning and have a lot more power left over to run the AC longer.

[mumkin]

My new rig goes on the line July 10 and today I ordered the EcoTrek 200 - the smallest option in their smallest rig. I admit to not really understanding any of this, but it will double my amp hours, which should be as much as I need for my current travels. Now I need to order a Trimetric monitor.

[markopolo]

I expect you'll be able to run the microwave oven right off the batteries no problem. Same with other loads like a toaster or coffee maker etc.

The 200 should be able to start the air conditioner but runtime would be limited. Of course you can always run the van engine.

Great for you and great for us to hear of first hand experience with this new tech!

[mojoman]

I'm hoping my extra effort and $$ in insulation will lengthen the run time of my A/C. I'm using Aerogel,Thinsulate, gym rubber, foam and ceramic beads. I',m Adding 1/4" Plexiglass to the windows to make them double pane.

[mumkin]

Yes... run time on the AC will be limited to lots of factors. But I'm thinking that if I've been driving a few hours with my vehicle AC running and the batteries fully charged, I should be able to run the AC for about an hour while I run in to do a bit of shopping.

I will probably also add the new Voltrek system when they get it out for the Chevy. That will automatically start the engine to re charge the battery if it starts to get low... and then my time will be limited to the gas tank. LOL

The things we do for our dogs...

[markopolo]

I'm a bit behind on the news ........ I see it's no retrofits now:

https://www.facebook.com/groups/road...22%3A%22R3%22}

It's not too surprising given the complications involved. Wiring, isolator, fuses, inverter, charging etc. would have to be replaced in most rigs.

Also, what happened to the Roadtreking Forum? http://roadtreking.com/forum/ Is it temporarily down or have they given up on it and are focusing all efforts on the Facebook group now? I didn't visit that forum much but would pop by to check the Ask Roadtrek topic occasionally.

[wincrasher]

Yeah, his reasoning is that so many people want them, they can't possibly give people what they want! What kind of business would they be then? It's just easier and more profitable for you to come in and buy a new van. Oh, and please delete any copies of those promises I made! Then a bunch of "it's OK Jim, we still love you" posts. LOL.

[markopolo]

I really think Jim wanted to do it but it is complicated. A 1/2 retrofit (just adding the new lithium batteries) would have led to "I have the Ecotrek and it doesn't run my microwave oven" type of complaint posts.

[wincrasher]

Most likely his mouth got ahead of his brain. It's a huge undertaking to commit to doing retrofits on older vans. At first they were cutting it off to models within the last few years, which sounded reasonable. Now it's just new ones that are sitting on dealer lots.

Other than the looky loos posting questions and phone calls, I wonder how many would really pony up the kind of bread to do this upgrade? I think alot would waste peoples times looking into it, but very few would cut a check.

[booster]

I have no idea if this could be part of the issue, or not, but the retrofits were going to done at the dealers, and that is a lot of folks to get onboard, trained, and able to do it, as Marko mentioned, a pretty complicated upgrade.

From what I have seen, and heard, of power system upgrades done by dealers, the results have not been stellar. Most of the techs don't seen to have the expertise needed to handle system wide stuff. I am sure there are exceptions, though.

I think when it all started, folks thought Roadtrek was talking about doing retrofits in all vans, then it moved to only the ones that had certain levels of original options (they would also be quite new), now no retrofits(?)

It might be a possibility that Roadtrek could partner with a few top end dealers to address the retrofit questions. That way the ones doing the work would have the experience plus factory help if needed for questions. It would also allow being able to do any/all vans to various levels of update, only hopefully with better results than they get now, similar to updates that they do now. With limited dealers and good training, they could assure the fancy stuff only went into applications that it belonged in.

[BobB]

Originally Posted by booster

I have no idea if this could be part of the issue, or not, but the retrofits were going to done at the dealers, and that is a lot of folks to get onboard, trained, and able to do it, a Marko mentioned, a pretty complicated upgrade.

Plus Wincrasher's comment "Yeah, his reasoning is that so many people want them.........."

Somewhere - out there - hopefully, some (just need a couple) dealer is reading this and thinking "now there's a market opening" - offering lithium system retrofits/upgrades to RT owners. Get the parts, train a team, and advertise.

We'll see.

[booster]

Originally Posted by BobB

Plus Wincrasher's comment "Yeah, his reasoning is that so many people want them.........."

Somewhere - out there - hopefully, some (just need a couple) dealer is reading this and thinking "now there's a market opening" - offering lithium system retrofits/upgrades to RT owners. Get the parts, train a team, and advertise.

We'll see.

Yep--like I said earlier, it would be a good business model, I think. If the dealer does it on their own, though, they somehow have to convince Roadtrek to sell them the lithium "magic" stuff, which might be tough.

[BobB]

Originally Posted by booster

Yep--like I said earlier, it would be a good business model, I think. If the dealer does it on their own, though, they somehow have to convince Roadtrek to sell them the lithium "magic" stuff, which might be tough.

I like the dealers taking the lead on this. I think if the dealer really thinks he has (and can demonstrate to RT) the expertise to do the retrofit, then RT should let them. RT can then look over their shoulder and provide additional QC.

That may be a better scenario than RT pushing all dealers to do the retrofit, where you might end up with some who know what they are doing and some not.

[Arlo]

Originally Posted by markopolo

Also, what happened to the Roadtreking Forum? http://roadtreking.com/forum/ Is it temporarily down or have they given up on it and are focusing all efforts on the Facebook group now?

Mike W. shut it down a couple weeks ago and sent users an email suggesting that they join the FB group.

[booster]

Originally Posted by BobB

I like the dealers taking the lead on this. I think if the dealer really thinks he has (and can demonstrate to RT) the expertise to do the retrofit, then RT should let them. RT can then look over their shoulder and provide additional QC.

That may be a better scenario than RT pushing all dealers to do the retrofit, where you might end up with some who know what they are doing and some not.

I totally agree

[Davydd]

I suspect the dealers gave Roadtrek a, "WTF?" No way are they prepared to do extensive retrofits and like us might want to know what that "magic" stuff is before making any commitments. I believe they also rebelled on some of the ambitious Etrek like electrical and battery features that were initially announced on the Zion. If you remember Roadtrek backtracked on its comments there too.

Gerrym51, Where does this leave you?