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03-29-2019, 04:12 AM
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#21
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Chaska MN
Posts: 1,710
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keyne
Has JH and crew been charged with crimes? I read the rumors but didnt know if it actually proceeded to official charges. Any updates on that front?
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Nary a peep... in any of the legal documents so far...
__________________
2021 Promaster 1500 118wb conversion
2019 Roadtrek Simplicity SRT (almost a Zion)
2015 Roadtrek 170
2011 LTV Libero
2004 GWV Classic Supreme
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03-29-2019, 10:57 AM
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#22
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Gold Member
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Nomad
Posts: 85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregmchugh
It appears that there are those who are gnawing at the bit to get the opportunity to dance on the grave of Roadtrek, can’t wait to say “I Told You So” ...  |
I definitely don’t want to say “I told you so“, but I knew and predicted that this was going to happen when Hymer bought Roadtrek a few years ago. I’ve Blogged aabout it and ranged on my YouTube channel about it… I just knew this was gonna happen. And it’s a shame.
I feel so bad for the Roadtrek owners and even worse for the Axion, Banff, and Sunlight owners.
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03-29-2019, 03:46 PM
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#23
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Chaska MN
Posts: 1,710
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VocalVirgo
I feel so bad for the Roadtrek owners and even worse for the Axion, Banff, and Sunlight owners.
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All three of those models are now owned by Thor. They have said nothing about how they are going to handle this... whether they will be continued in the US by Thor in one of their factories or not. I suspect that they won't be reporting on their future plans for them until any remaining models half built at the Canadian factory are resolved.
__________________
2021 Promaster 1500 118wb conversion
2019 Roadtrek Simplicity SRT (almost a Zion)
2015 Roadtrek 170
2011 LTV Libero
2004 GWV Classic Supreme
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03-29-2019, 03:57 PM
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#24
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 12,002
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I would expect most everyone to stay silent until after any/all offers are put on the table and time runs out to decide.
IIRC, the documentation said that the potential bidders included complete purchase and partials if it was broken up when it talked about opening up the books for the bidders.
All of the business stuff is likely going to be kept totally separate from any criminal or claw back legal stuff so that could still be not going to happen or be in the near or far future, I think.
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03-29-2019, 10:08 PM
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#25
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,380
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03-29-2019, 10:25 PM
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#26
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 12,002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregmchugh
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It would appear to be leaning toward asset sale, rather than complete, from the judges comments?
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03-30-2019, 12:28 AM
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#27
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Gold Member
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Nomad
Posts: 85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mumkin
All three of those models are now owned by Thor. They have said nothing about how they are going to handle this... whether they will be continued in the US by Thor in one of their factories or not. I suspect that they won't be reporting on their future plans for them until any remaining models half built at the Canadian factory are resolved.
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I literally can not keep up. I had no idea Thor had purchased any part of what used to be Hymer, EHGNA, or Roadtrek. I am exhausted by all of it, lol. And I still feel bad for owners.
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03-30-2019, 01:41 AM
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#28
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,380
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VocalVirgo
I literally can not keep up. I had no idea Thor had purchased any part of what used to be Hymer, EHGNA, or Roadtrek. I am exhausted by all of it, lol. And I still feel bad for owners.
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I don’t think Thor will be changing the brand names in Europe. I suppose they could change the name of the parent company, Erwin Hymer Group, but they may just leave it as is since it is well known and successful.
After a time period the only brand left in EHGNA would be Roadtrek assuming anything survives to live another day, the other brands reused from Europe are owned by Thor.
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03-30-2019, 02:53 AM
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#29
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Chaska MN
Posts: 1,710
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VocalVirgo
I literally can not keep up. I had no idea Thor had purchased any part of what used to be Hymer, EHGNA, or Roadtrek. I am exhausted by all of it, lol. And I still feel bad for owners.
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This whole debacle started because of Thor's purchase of the Hymer company. They were interested in entering the market in Europe.
Meanwhile, the Hymer company's branch known as EHGNA had been financially tanked by the Hymer family in their 2+ year wild expansion all done on credit which they piled into Roadtrek and then made a deal with Thor to remove EHGNA from the deal... sell it Corner Flag (which is just a Delaware LLC owned by the Hymer family) and slap it into the Receivership.
Part of the smoke filled room deal may very well have been that Thor would then pick it up from the Receiver for a song... they can take whatever they want down to their facilities in Indiana and sell off the leftovers.
At that point we will find out if they plan to build "Roadtreks" or just bury the name to restrict the competition.
With any luck one of the other 19 or 20 companies who have shown some interest will buy it and re-start Roadtrek in the old factory.
__________________
2021 Promaster 1500 118wb conversion
2019 Roadtrek Simplicity SRT (almost a Zion)
2015 Roadtrek 170
2011 LTV Libero
2004 GWV Classic Supreme
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03-30-2019, 08:48 AM
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#30
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Gold Member
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Nomad
Posts: 85
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Are you telling me that Thor is buying HYMER – the entire company? Europe, North America - the whole thing? This is what’s happening?
I just assumed that they would buy EHGNA, kill off the crappy vans, but keep Roadtrek going. I had no idea that the entire Hymer company in Europe was for sale. Wow.
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03-30-2019, 12:06 PM
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#31
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,058
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VocalVirgo
Are you telling me that Thor is buying HYMER – the entire company? Europe, North America - the whole thing? This is what’s happening?
I just assumed that they would buy EHGNA, kill off the crappy vans, but keep Roadtrek going. I had no idea that the entire Hymer company in Europe was for sale. Wow.
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thor put in motion buying Hymer europe and NA over a year ago for 2.5 billion dollars.
It'w when the sale was about to close that the discrepencies in NA operations where discovred.
To rescue the sale NA was cut out.
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03-30-2019, 03:45 PM
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#33
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 5,967
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Why blame Hymer? They were scammed by the holding company that bought Roadtrek in 2011 as far as I can tell. Hymer made a couple of false starts in North America. It was incompetence. Their fault in this is they did not do due diligence in buying Roadtrek and in retaining the management team. You probably can thank Thor in doing due diligence and exposing the scam. As a result Hymer is left holding the bag (EHGNA) and basically having to shed it. I kind of doubt Roadtrek will come back under anyone other than the name rights of Roadtrek in completely new models and if Thor does pick it up they have several facilities and could upfit them in the USA. Don't bank on anyone assuming responsibility for the old company. It doesn't make sense. That's the way I see it at this time.
__________________
Davydd
2021 Advanced RV 144 custom Sprinter
2015 Advanced RV Extended body Sprinter
2011 Great West Van Legend Sprinter
2005 Pleasure-way Plateau TS Sprinter
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03-30-2019, 03:49 PM
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#34
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Chaska MN
Posts: 1,710
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VocalVirgo
I just assumed that they would buy EHGNA, kill off the crappy vans, but keep Roadtrek going.
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Not sure why you thought Thor would kill off the crappy vans. They seem to have no issues with selling crappy products with bad warranties... they are happy to do so.
__________________
2021 Promaster 1500 118wb conversion
2019 Roadtrek Simplicity SRT (almost a Zion)
2015 Roadtrek 170
2011 LTV Libero
2004 GWV Classic Supreme
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03-30-2019, 03:58 PM
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#35
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Chaska MN
Posts: 1,710
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davydd
Why blame Hymer? They were scammed by the holding company that bought Roadtrek in 2011 as far as I can tell. Hymer made a couple of false starts in North America. It was incompetence.
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You hit the answer right there... incompetence. Look at the details in the legal documents. Look at the huge long list of liabilities. They hugely over-expanded on borrowed money... from EHG Europe... from banks... from Mercedes... a couple hundred million dollars or more. Not to mention the other hundred million owed to suppliers, employees, dealers, salesman and customers. The cause of the collapse wasn't cooked books or executives lining their pockets - both of which likely occurred. (see "lack of due diligence" by Hymer)
I put 80% of the blame on Hymer... 20% on the executives.
__________________
2021 Promaster 1500 118wb conversion
2019 Roadtrek Simplicity SRT (almost a Zion)
2015 Roadtrek 170
2011 LTV Libero
2004 GWV Classic Supreme
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03-30-2019, 04:06 PM
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#36
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 5,967
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The way I look at it is I have no skin in the game anyway and have alway considered Roadtrek behind Great West Vans, Liesure Travel Vans and Pleasure-way in Canada.
__________________
Davydd
2021 Advanced RV 144 custom Sprinter
2015 Advanced RV Extended body Sprinter
2011 Great West Van Legend Sprinter
2005 Pleasure-way Plateau TS Sprinter
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03-30-2019, 06:08 PM
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#37
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Gold Member
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Nomad
Posts: 85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gerrym51
thor put in motion buying Hymer europe and NA over a year ago for 2.5 billion dollars.
It'w when the sale was about to close that the discrepencies in NA operations where discovred.
To rescue the sale NA was cut out.
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Yes, of course I knew that... I did a long Blog Post about Thor’s plan to acquire EHGNA. I just didn’t realize they didn’t pull out completely when all of the discrepancies showed up. I thought they pulled out of the deal. Completely. It looks like I have some reading to catch up on!
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03-31-2019, 05:41 AM
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#38
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Chaska MN
Posts: 1,710
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davydd
The way I look at it is I have no skin in the game anyway and have alway considered Roadtrek behind Great West Vans, Liesure Travel Vans and Pleasure-way in Canada.
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I agree with you 100%... and I have had a GWV and an LTV... both vastly superior in quality to either of my RTs.
__________________
2021 Promaster 1500 118wb conversion
2019 Roadtrek Simplicity SRT (almost a Zion)
2015 Roadtrek 170
2011 LTV Libero
2004 GWV Classic Supreme
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04-02-2019, 02:39 AM
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#39
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,380
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04-02-2019, 03:07 AM
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#40
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 12,002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregmchugh
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Be it only the NA group management or all of Hymer, also, it just shows another piece of a puzzle that shows they really didn't care about rules, regulations, laws, or even safety, it appears. Adds much more heft to the claims of Continuous Improvements group as it shows even more of a pattern. I wonder what kind of penalties can be levied since the business is essentially gone at this point. If there things the receiver has to do to settle all of this, there could be even less in assets to sell at the end which would further hurt the unsecured creditors.
A sad end for a once good company.
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