need advise on installing a transmission cooler

[THEBRAIN]

need advise on installing a transmission cooler
05 Chevy express 3500.. images of how you installed would be a big help.
like which trans tube at radiator is the cooler spliced into the top or bottom?
my van doesn't have a original trans. cooler however it doe's have a metal loop under the radiator core surport I think it's a power steering cooler?

normaley I would cut both trans tubes at radiator an bypass the rad.an leave the rad ports opened however the pass. side has this other cooler.
so it mite be better to splice int one of he trans tubes at rad an insert the cooler then back into rad..just don'tknow which tube at rad to splice into.

thanks for advising

 

[booster]

First do a Google search for 4L80el transmission cooler line connection in and out location.

Follow the cooler line from the output and that would go to the top port hole for the cooler in the radiator so wouldn't need to be cut.

From the lower of the radiator cooler ports run a new hose to the cooler. You will multiple opinions on upper or lower if the ports are on the side. I use the lower to eliminate the trapped air you can get in the top of the cooler is you go in the top. Technically connecting to the top is more thermodynamically correct, I think, but not as much as it is in a radiator.

From the other cooler port go back and connect it to return line to the transmission.

For towing don't buy a cheap tube and fin one or a small one. You will need a large, thick, plate and fin, type and it still may be not enough cooling if you are towing heavy. Getting one with it's own fan on it can help a lot.

 

[THEBRAIN]

I’ve spent hours searching which line to splice into what I find is a bunch of backward crap.mostly truck stuff not anything on vans.Like the trucks have the trans lines on the pass. Side, the express has trans. On the driver side. An some other cooler on the pass. Side. Like what the heck is that loop under rad core surport?



then there’s the year change which changes ins an outs.the net bot says to feel the lines an the cooler one is the feed to the cooler. I don’t know what to think. Proballey should just bypass the rad. All together.



Then w/ a side mount arrangement I believe it doesn’t matter which is input or output to auxiliary cooler?



So you are suggesting to splice the rads. lower trans. Tube then feed it into the external cooler then out cooler back into the other end of the splice.

Thanks for explaining about w/ side ports top an bottom. So if I had both input an output on top there’s no augument.

oh an yes I've been towing my cruiser to the lake one way is 31 miles w/ a few slite inclines. vessel an trailer are around 3600LBs

 

[booster]

 

[THEBRAIN]

ok so I splice into the return tube correct? where did you find that image I spent hours searching? I even searched w/ google. additionaly I wanted to replace the internal trans. fliter but didn't know which to order I thin this van has the deep type pan.

could this pan have a drain in the middle thees a indented section? thanks booster

 

[booster]

I searched for 4L80e transmission cooler port locations and it came up to a forum that showed a place called Grumpy's garage which I have seen in the past. I changed the search to images and there it was.

I then did a similar search by adding "by year" and came up some older stuff that showed older than 1997 had the ports both in the front, one above the other. Didn't take more than 10 minutes.

Express vans are rare compared to other GM trucks so search the component, rather than the model, can be much more effective. It is easy then to just go to any given year and see if it was used in the vans. I do it all the time.

 

[youngnretired]

I just added an external transmission cooler on our 08 chevy 210. The link to what i did is below. I changed out one transmission line and added another and a factory style external cooler, all for a factory appearance and parts.

The cooler flows: transmission to upper radiator port, lower radiator port to external cooler, then from the external cooler back to the trans. I personally would leave the radiator trans cooler in the circuit as the external one that we added maybe isn't doing a whole lot.

I believe the lines under the radiator are power steering.

If yours is like mine, there are oil cooler lines running to the hot side of the radiator. Your 2nd picture is of the hot side and those aren't the transmission cooler lines.

https://www.classbforum.com/threads/express-van-upgrade-cooling-system-with-a-2-row-radiator.1117135/

 

[booster]

I just added an external transmission cooler on our 08 chevy 210. The link to what i did is below. I changed out one transmission line and added another and a factory style external cooler, all for a factory appearance and parts.

The cooler flows: transmission to upper radiator port, lower radiator port to external cooler, then from the external cooler back to the trans. I personally would leave the radiator trans cooler in the circuit as the external one that we added maybe isn't doing a whole lot.

I believe the lines under the radiator are power steering.

If yours is like mine, there are oil cooler lines running to the hot side of the radiator. Your 2nd picture is of the hot side and those aren't the transmission cooler lines.

https://www.classbforum.com/threads/express-van-upgrade-cooling-system-with-a-2-row-radiator.1117135/

Yep, as I mentioned, even with huge coolers it will get hot on hills, especially when towing. Leaving it out of the radiator just makes it worse.

Lots of information on this forum on the issue and all that has been tried to keep them cool and almost none of them work.

One user mounted a very large fan cooled add on cooler under the van that is said to have worked well.

Our van and some others have reprogrammed the PCM to change the converter lockup points and transmission shift points. This has been shown to work very well in our van and has eliminated essentially all of the issues we had that all the other things did not fix, we have them all in our van except the big underbody cooler and fan.

Before spending a lot of effort and money on it, I would recommend reading the extensive discussions on trying to keep the 4 speeds cool in the hills. This has been very thoroughly hashed out over the years.

 

[booster]

Click the links for the discussions

programming link

Radiators

trans coolers

 

[Bangorbob]

I already had a small trans cooler on mine but replaced with the same one that youngretired installed. Honestly I didn't see much difference at all. Good luck!

 

[THEBRAIN]

I just added an external transmission cooler on our 08 chevy 210. The link to what i did is below. I changed out one transmission line and added another and a factory style external cooler, all for a factory appearance and parts.

The cooler flows: transmission to upper radiator port, lower radiator port to external cooler, then from the external cooler back to the trans. I personally would leave the radiator trans cooler in the circuit as the external one that we added maybe isn't doing a whole lot.

I believe the lines under the radiator are power steering.

If yours is like mine, there are oil cooler lines running to the hot side of the radiator. Your 2nd picture is of the hot side and those aren't the transmission cooler lines.

https://www.classbforum.com/threads/express-van-upgrade-cooling-system-with-a-2-row-radiator.1117135/

please post images of how your trans. cooler is installed. an thanks

 

[youngnretired]

I looked at the link in my original comment and it's going to an AC changeout, but the text shown is for my upgrade. Not sure that happened. The updated link is below.

There are pictures of the external cooler from the box and with it installed. You remove the two bolts holding the two vertical bars in front of the AC condenser, and install the new cooler. It's a pretty easy install, except for the one line replacement from the trans. That's a little more involved, but it was doable from the van on the ground raised a bit for access.

Express Van Upgrade Cooling System With a 2 Row Radiator

 

[Bangorbob]

Here is a pic of the new installed cooler.

 

[THEBRAIN]

Here is a pic of the new installed cooler.

thats an orginal OEM cooler where they supplied the conections.
my van never had a cooler.
I'm assuming the out of the trans. goe's to the bottom of the rad. rad then heats up fuild then out the top of rad. back to trans. which is the return line booster was kindof to post image of.

here's my plan cut the top of rad. tube out of rad go into the side mounted coolers bottom port, out the cooler top port back into the cut rad tube which is the return.

if it wasn't for the I think power steering on opposite side of rad. I'd eliminate the rad alltogether.

I plan an arrangment like this. on driverside where the trans tubes are on rad.

thanks

 

[THEBRAIN]

I looked at the link in my original comment and it's going to an AC changeout, but the text shown is for my upgrade. Not sure that happened. The updated link is below.

There are pictures of the external cooler from the box and with it installed. You remove the two bolts holding the two vertical bars in front of the AC condenser, and install the new cooler. It's a pretty easy install, except for the one line replacement from the trans. That's a little more involved, but it was doable from the van on the ground raised a bit for access.

Express Van Upgrade Cooling System With a 2 Row Radiator

yes I've glanced over your radator thread didn't remember the little trans cooler. why did you install a giant rad an a tiny trans cooler? thanks

 

[booster]

thats an orginal OEM cooler where they supplied the conections.
my van never had a cooler.
I'm assuming the out of the trans. goe's to the bottom of the rad. rad then heats up fuild then out the top of rad. back to trans. which is the return line booster was kindof to post image of.

here's my plan cut the top of rad. tube out of rad go into the side mounted coolers bottom port, out the cooler top port back into the cut rad tube which is the return.

if it wasn't for the I think power steering on opposite side of rad. I'd eliminate the rad alltogether.

I plan an arrangment like this. on driverside where the trans tubes are on rad.View attachment 1954601
thanks

As usual, you are losing me again. The transmission lines go into the passenger side of the radiator and engine oil cooler goes into the driver side if you have one, and I think all the Chevies do have the oil cooler.

The power steering/hydroboost cooler it the little loop of the bottom shroud of the radiator, I am pretty sure, that you showed.

I said that I use the lower to go in and out the top, but GM probably went in the top because the coolant is cooler at the bottom most of the time so out there. Don't cut anything until you know which line is the one that the hot oil comes out in. Wherever that one is just leave it in the radiator and connect the cooler to the other one as it will not be an issue either way.

As you cam see in your pic, the trans cooler is on the passenger side. It is a pretty clean install and may be AN fittings which are the best, but very expensive. They could also be compression fittings that look like AN fittings which are pretty common. I would not use hose clamps only as they can be huge problems even if you put a partial bubble flair on the bare tubes. Lots of transmissions have been damaged by blown of hose clamp installs on trans coolers.

Don't even dream of bypassing the radiator with the trans cooling as you will overheat almost instantly. All that have tried the older style factory cooler and the one you have know that the add on factory coolers are not up to the task. If you look at the pics of our system on the link I provided earlier, you see two big/thick plate and fin coolers that are fan cooled also. They could not keep up with trans cooling even through the radiator on tough climbs and with a bigger radiator. Retired young said that he got little if any help from the cooler you have.

Did you read the links on cooling and such provided earlier. All this information is there with testing data and such. It is very difficult to fix the trans cooling in the 4 speed Chevies that are fully loaded to 9600# and towing makes it worse. If you continue going as you are, you going to have to go through all the steps that don't work like the rest of us did and that is expensive and very labor intensive. Listen to what people are saying about it all and read all that didn't work when tried because it is an extensive list of all the normal things that are done to improve cooling. Don't believe anything you read that doesn't give results data like what long climb did they tested on, how hot was it, what were the engine and transmission temperatures etc because the internet is full of bad information on stuff like this and people will put in a cooler and say it works "perfect" on all climbs in any weather.

 

[THEBRAIN]

As you cam see in your pic, the trans cooler is on the passenger side. I think you are correct as usalle that cooler is on the pass side. I will have to crawl back under there an trace these trans tubes again I could have of sworn they routed to driver side additionaly they where fatter click to expand for entire response t is a pretty clean install and may be AN fittings which are the best, but very expensive. They couIld also be compression fittings that look like AN fittings which are pretty common. I would not use hose clamps only as they can be huge problems even if you put a partial bubble flair on the bare tubes. Lots of transmissions have been damaged by blown of hose clamp installs on trans coolers.
Yes I have a flare tool to insure the rubber coolers tube doesn't get blown off additionaly I'll use fuel injection type clamps to secure the rubber tubes previuos coolers I'd use two worm gear clamps opposeing each other like a boat fuel sys.
Don't even dream of bypassing the radiator with the trans cooling as you will overheat almost instantly.

I must parochialy dissagree w/ this bc on my highly modified 99 trans am heads/cam/long tubes/intake.HP tuned suspension ect. I've had a B&M super cooler mounted w/ both input an out put pointing downward in series w/ a conventional tube an fin type input an output horizontally also the 2nd cooler in the series for over 22 years bypassing the rad. same w/ the modded Saab SUV w/ it's 5.3 L33. AWD. maybe both these 4L60 trans do well bypassing the rad. (which basicely heats the fuild up to 190 same as rad.s fuild) bc I live in centrel Alabama it hardly ever freezes.
now the TA weights only 3550LB the Saab weights 4650LBs both 4L60.

the 4 ton van has a much stronger trans. it just never made sense to me about heating up the trans fuild just to cool it down?

anyway for the van I'll opt to retain the rad cooler w/ additional auxillary tube an fine type. will report back an thanks again booster.

All that have tried the older style factory cooler and the one you have know that the add on factory coolers are not up to the task. If you look at the pics of our system on the link I provided earlier, you see two big/thick plate and fin coolers that are fan cooled also. They could not keep up with trans cooling even through the radiator on tough climbs and with a bigger radiator. Retired young said that he got little if any help from the cooler you have.

 

[booster]

One more and I am done. You can't compare cars to the vans because the vans are over double the weight and probably double the wind resistance, apples to oranges. Cars rarely see full throttle for more than 15 seconds or so. 4L60s do seem to run cooler than the 4L80in the vans but hard to tell in the lighter vehicles that almost never are under full load and we don't know what the torque converter lockup programming is like so also apples to oranges. The converter lockup is the critical thing and the vans leave it unlocked to much of the time, I think to gain more power at the expense of heat generation in the transmission. I have a 4L60e in my 5000# Buick Roadmaster Wagon and even with a stock radiator .8" single core design it would run the car and the huge AC they have in it and never get hot. The engine is an 5.7 LT1 genII that is a torquer motor for the heavy vehicle stock at 260hp 335ft-lbs. I came with 2.53 gears so slow getting going. I built a similar curve shape engine with more lift and better piston design etc so no is probably near 300hp and 360hp and has 3.23 gears. Still runs cool without issue on the hottest days, in traffic, and it still has the stock 1996 twin electric fans. Compare that to dragging 9600# up a mountain in second or third gear and near full throttle putting in over 300hp to a non locked converter for a half hour straight and that is when you get hot. We have been there and done that over the years with all the various improvements. Ours literally hit 240* and went into thermal reduction mode that locked the converter and on that steep grade we couldn't move. Your van and ours will not lock the converter until about 50 mph in second gear so useless on a steep 35 mph climb. In the links the shift and lockup points are shown so you can see for yourself on the programming tables that are posted.

If you hit any tough pulling or hills you will overheat just like the rest of us have.

 

[youngnretired]

As I previously posted, the fluid goes from the trans to the top radiator fitting. I also said that I replaced one transmission line that adds the factory style external cooler. I didn't want to start cutting lines, so i went with factory replacement pieces.

I purchased two external coolers and intended to somehow install the two of them. I quickly realized I'd need to get pretty creative to mount the second one. I also ran out of time before our 2 month trip. The radiator project should have taken 2 days, but ended up taking a month. I didn't know what to expect for trans temps on our trip, but I figured an additional external cooler can't hurt as the van survived for 76000 miles before we got it.

Learned a lot on our trip. In most situations, the transmission runs at 90-100 degrees above ambient temps, excluding climbing hills. As we got into colder temps closer to home, the transmission actually runs at 110+ degrees above ambient when the air temp was in the 30s and 40s

Our 2008 Roadtrek has an actual power steering cooler on the underside of the radiator. See pic

 

[THEBRAIN]

ok I'm sorted out on the trans lines

still confussed about the internal trans fliter to order I need to know which type pan I have I think one is deep an other is regular.
why would RA have 4L60 transimsions listed for the 3500 w/ LQ4 6 litre engine