New to RVs and Hopeful Warp Core RoadTrekkers

[WingedRyno]

Whenever you are connected to shore power and turn the inverter on, the battery charger in the inverter is attempting to charge the batteries.

When that is happening, will the converter in the inverter be doing that while the inverter appears to be off? The inverter has an LCD display up top and some graphics and lights and stuff -- will this converter process happen while all that is off?

 

[WingedRyno]

Fancy title. That would kind of confirm he was the guy I met who was running the place, and is an employee in reality, not an owner. That would fit in with Dale buying Monticello from him news I saw.

If Wingedryno can get a chance to talk to Dale, I do think it would be a good idea. He has always tried to put the customers first, from all I have heard and seen.

I asked the sales guy to forward my lodging request to Dale. Thanks for that info. Hopefully between RT and the dealer, somebody can keep me local so I don't need to fly back. I can give them my time, but these hotel costs are quickly becoming more than I can afford.

 

[gregmchugh]

When that is happening, will the converter in the inverter be doing that while the inverter appears to be off? The inverter has an LCD display up top and some graphics and lights and stuff -- will this converter process happen while all that is off?

The RT inverter needs to be turned on at the wall panel and off on the inverter box in order to operate. If the wall switch is on but you are not on shore power and all the Ecotreks are offline then the inverter should appear to be off (it has no power source) but if an Ecotrek came back online it will likely start operating since the wall switch is in the on position.

 

[WingedRyno]

The RT inverter needs to be turned on at the wall panel and off on the inverter box in order to operate. If the wall switch is on but you are not on shore power and all the Ecotreks are offline then the inverter should appear to be off (it has no power source) but if an Ecotrek came back online it will likely start operating since the wall switch is in the on position.

During my overnight mystery, the inverter was turned on at the wall switch and off on the box and it was on shore power. The Ecotreks were all offline and the inverter appeared to be off.

In the morning one of the EcoTreks had popped online but the inverter still showed no power (didn't show shore power on the panel, either). But once I reset the EcoTrek that was online, everything popped online.

At this point it seems to me that with all EcoTreks offline even shore power will not power the inverter/converter.

 

[gregmchugh]

During my overnight mystery, the inverter was turned on at the wall switch and off on the box and it was on shore power. The Ecotreks were all offline and the inverter appeared to be off.

In the morning one of the EcoTreks had popped online but the inverter still showed no power (didn't show shore power on the panel, either). But once I reset the EcoTrek that was online, everything popped online.

At this point it seems to me that with all EcoTreks offline even shore power will not power the inverter/converter.

That would not be normal, is it possible that the shore power was not getting to the inverter due to a tripped circuit breaker either on the front side of the inverter or in the circuit you were plugged into?

 

[WingedRyno]

That would not be normal, is it possible that the shore power was not getting to the inverter due to a tripped circuit breaker either on the front side of the inverter or in the circuit you were plugged into?

No, power was good on the cord and all the lights were illuminated. And later (after overnight when a module came online for some reason) shore power was able to power everything without any c/bs being reset.

Are you saying that shore power should have powered the inverter/converter despite all the EcoTreks being offline?

 

[booster]

I think that folks that have some knowledge of the systems might do us all a favor and make a sketch of the how they understand the power system to be wired. With two imputs, lots of chargers, a billion switches, inverters, etc. A picture is worth 1000 words, or more, as they say.

 

[gerrym51]

That would not be normal, is it possible that the shore power was not getting to the inverter due to a tripped circuit breaker either on the front side of the inverter or in the circuit you were plugged into?

i'm pretty sure this has come up before on the other site. the inverter/charger needs an active battery in loop to accept any shore power. I have no idea why but i think others have commented on this

 

[booster]

i'm pretty sure this has come up before on the other site. the inverter/charger needs an active battery in loop to accept any shore power. I have no idea why but i think others have commented on this

Most inverter/chargers or plain chargers need to see the 12 of a battery to initiate themselves. Some even check to see if it is a real battery that will accept charging amps before going full on. It is to protect the rest of the system because without a battery, the charger will not be able to hold accurate voltage. If it were a true 12v power supply, it would be not need to have the battery in the circuit to function.

 

[gregmchugh]

i'm pretty sure this has come up before on the other site. the inverter/charger needs an active battery in loop to accept any shore power. I have no idea why but i think others have commented on this

As I recall people have had the inverter on with only shore power and no Ecotreks online and reported that the 12v power was very unstable. Better info can be had over on the owner's Facebook group, not many owners here to share info.

 

[gregmchugh]

I think that folks that have some knowledge of the systems might do us all a favor and make a sketch of the how they understand the power system to be wired. With two imputs, lots of chargers, a billion switches, inverters, etc. A picture is worth 1000 words, or more, as they say.

Awhile ago I would have drawn up something but I have a severe lack of interest in Roadtrek electrical systems these days.

As in the Farside Cartoon where the kid in class says, "Teacher, may I be excused, my brain is full...".

Full of RT minutiae that needs to be purged to make room for info on the operation of the new vehicle...

 

[WingedRyno]

I'm pretty sure Jim Hammil also said that with all the EckoTreks offline, the inverter/converter will not be powered by shore power.

 

[WingedRyno]

Talked with Scott who is a 30% owner (Dale is on vacation so I couldn't reach him). After I got off the phone with him the service manager called me with a FedEx tracking number!

The new Balmar will be shipped by Nations (programmed for 1600 amps of lithium -- I guess they supplied Nations with a bar code on the GU) and will be here by 1030AM tomorrow. The manager said it won't take him more than 45 minutes to install it.

Fingers crossed.

 

[cruising7388]

While I admit I haven't yet tested out Alde floor heating or the dumping of the tanks or driving of the vehicle, this van seems to be well within reach of making us happy campers. I just hope that happens sooner rather than later as my credit card is exploding with hotel costs...

You may have gotten to the bottom of this. It's time to check and see if Roadtrek owns all the hotels surrounding their dealerships.

 

[cruising7388]

When that is happening, will the converter in the inverter be doing that while the inverter appears to be off? The inverter has an LCD display up top and some graphics and lights and stuff -- will this converter process happen while all that is off?

There are inverter/converters designed so that these two functions can operate independently of each other. This is not the case with the RT design where the inverter will operate and deliver 120V while the converter is unpowered, i.e. no shore power. However, the shore power convertercharger will not operate without the inverter being turned on. With shore power connected, turning on the inverter doesn't provide 120V to the receptacles, it isn't actually delivering 120V. It is merely providing support that permits converter/charger operation. that asllows 120V to pass through to the AC breakers. So, if shore power is supplied, not only does the powered up inverter not supply 120V - it can't.

 

[gregmchugh]

There are inverter/converters designed so that these two functions can operate independently of each other. This is not the case with the RT design where the inverter will operate and deliver 120V while the converter is unpowered, i.e. no shore power. However, the shore power convertercharger will not operate without the inverter being turned on. With shore power connected, turning on the inverter doesn't provide 120V to the receptacles, it isn't actually delivering 120V. It is merely providing support that permits converter/charger operation. that asllows 120V to pass through to the AC breakers. So, if shore power is supplied, not only does the powered up inverter not supply 120V - it can't.

Not sure how well the RT inverter handles it but the advantage of having the inverter on when on shore power can be to allow uninterrupted 120v power when the 120v shore power dies. With the older TrippLite inverter you could have the inverter on or off when on shore/generator power with the advantage of uninterrupted power if the inverter was on and you lost shore/generator power. You would need to remember to turn off the TrippLite when you disconnected from shore power or stopped the generator to avoid draining the batteries due to the parasitic load of the inverter.

 

[WingedRyno]

Not sure how well the RT inverter handles it but the advantage of having the inverter on when on shore power can be to allow uninterrupted 120v power when the 120v shore power dies. With the older TrippLite inverter you could have the inverter on or off when on shore/generator power with the advantage of uninterrupted power if the inverter was on and you lost shore/generator power. You would need to remember to turn off the TrippLite when you disconnected from shore power or stopped the generator to avoid draining the batteries due to the parasitic load of the inverter.

I think the inverter has to be one when on during shorepower in the RT. It's a combined inverter/converter and if it's not on, I believe no AC power is being converted to charge the batteries or power the coach and I'm *pretty* sure no AC power is delivered to the coach either.

 

[gregmchugh]

I think the inverter has to be one when on during shorepower in the RT. It's a combined inverter/converter and if it's not on, I believe no AC power is being converted to charge the batteries or power the coach and I'm *pretty* sure no AC power is delivered to the coach either.

That is correct. I was responding to a comment from someone else regarding the need to have the RT inverter turned on to get any function to activate. Just was highlighting the uninterrupted power feature which may be present in the RT inverter.

 

[markopolo-ClassB]

................... With the older TrippLite inverter you could have the inverter on or off ................

That's correct but note that the Tripp Lite itself (if using the remote switch) was still on if plugged into grid power. The only way to actually turn it off was a switch on the Tripp Lite unit itself.

The remote switch permitted two modes of "on" operation but no "off" (inverting off yes but Tripp Lite still turned on). The two modes while on and being controlled by the remote switch were 1) full function with inverter and 2) charge only.

If you didn't have the remote switch (like my 2004 RT) then you controlled the Tripp Lite operation from a three position switch on the inverter. They were: 1. auto-remote 2. off 3. charge only. #2 Off was actually off, like turned off - no charging, no inverting, nothing happening.

I had a good understanding of how the Tripp Lites worked: http://www.classbforum.com/forums/f8/tripp-lite-inverter-charger-how-to-make-a-remote-switch-18.html

 

[cruising7388]

Not sure how well the RT inverter handles it but the advantage of having the inverter on when on shore power can be to allow uninterrupted 120v power when the 120v shore power dies. With the older TrippLite inverter you could have the inverter on or off when on shore/generator power with the advantage of uninterrupted power if the inverter was on and you lost shore/generator power. You would need to remember to turn off the TrippLite when you disconnected from shore power or stopped the generator to avoid draining the batteries due to the parasitic load of the inverter.

I have no idea how RT effects the transition.

I think there are two ways to address the transfer of 120V shoreside power to the inverter, or vice versa. One way is to provide a delay during the switching sequence. This is the simplest way to accomplish this but the disadvantage is that there is a brief period where the 120V loads lose power. Some loads are indifferent to this but compressors don't like it. The prudent course is to drop all AC loads prior to switching over.

The other way is to address this is to narrow the interrupted period to a very small window which makes the shift transparent to the loads but this requires synchronizing the AC phase of the two sources. I believe my Prosine 2.0 accomplished that phase synchronization within a single 16 ms window and the loads never missed a beat.