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Old 06-26-2014, 02:54 AM   #1
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Default Biodiesel - MB Sprinter Warranty

With the increasing number of biodiesel pumps using greater than B5, some as high as B15 and soon to be B10 in Minnesota, what are Sprinter folks doing to mitigate engine damage, fuel filter clogging or poor performance issues?

B15 is currently found in Utah, the state with the most number of National Parks. Minnesota has mandated B10 effective July 1, 2014 and then B15 effective May 1, 2015. Illinois requires that diesel fuel contain a minimum of 5% biomass and the pumps read; "Contains a minimum of 5% biodiesel"...so you don't know what you are getting.

BTW, the Mercedes warranty does not cover engine repair if anything over B5 has been used.
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Old 06-26-2014, 03:46 AM   #2
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Default Re: Biodiesel - MB Sprinter Warranty

They've beat this issue around over on rv.net and also on irv2. General consensus is that you use what's available, minimize the use of anything over B5, keep close eye on oil levels, etc., and then let the chips fall. Goodness knows, there's lots of Sprinters around these days.

MB is being a bit obtuse, unwilling to commit, but it seems that problems from fuel are not widespread so far, and also that MB would have a hard time rejecting claims if you just use clean fuel from well known companies.

My rig isn't here yet, but my plan is to keep a log -- date, location, quantity, brand of fuel, B%. There's nothing more I can do about it.
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Old 06-26-2014, 02:01 PM   #3
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Default Re: Biodiesel - MB Sprinter Warranty

That's about right. Keep close eye on oil levels means keep it close to topped off and don't let it run low is what I understood. This is what was transcribed from a Mercedes Benz representative at Advanced RV Fest and Open House.

You can use bio-diesel B-5 or less. You can also use B-20 diesels but you have to be conscious of oil levels.
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Old 06-26-2014, 04:28 PM   #4
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Default Re: Biodiesel - MB Sprinter Warranty

You know on a couple of other forums I'm on, people are actually cancelling their new RV orders with Sprinter chassis because of this issue being that the issue is a BIG ongoing concern on these forums.
Misinformation is being given by the so-called "experts" as to anything over B5 causing major engine damage just by running one tank full.

Never fails to amaze me the naivete of some of these folks that believe all the b$%&^%t.....
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Old 06-26-2014, 04:52 PM   #5
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Default Re: Biodiesel - MB Sprinter Warranty

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobojay
You know on a couple of other forums I'm on, people are actually cancelling their new RV orders with Sprinter chassis because of this issue being that the issue is a BIG ongoing concern on these forums.
Misinformation is being given by the so-called "experts" as to anything over B5 causing major engine damage just by running one tank full.

Never fails to amaze me the naivete of some of these folks that believe all the b$%&^%t.....
I don't know that I would go that far with it. I will say the jury is still out on this one, as I have seen no hard evidence to real world testing or problems, nor have I seen any testing that says it is OK. MB is stating that their LAB TYPE testing shows a potential problem. I think it is premature to guess either way right now. The "experts" on both sides of this are guessing.

I will point out that the worriers have been correct on some of these things in the past. Lead free gas caused several years of problems with burned valves before putting in hardened exhaust seats became the norm. E10 gas also caused issues with corrosion and breaking loose debris until the technology and materials caught up. The change to SM rated oil with reduced zinc, which was said to be backward compatible, cost many hotrod, small engine, motorcycle folks engines until they finally went back to the old mix for old and race cars, small engines, etc.

There are precedences to look at this from either way.

Personally, I would probably wait a year or two if possible. If not, and I had to get a diesel (not just MB but all brands). I would be trying to get a hold of some of the labs that test stuff like this independently, like a university automotive engine lab. It will be interesting to see what the heavy users of diesel do. Fedex, UPS, etc.
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Old 06-26-2014, 09:49 PM   #6
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Default Re: Biodiesel - MB Sprinter Warranty

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobojay
You know on a couple of other forums I'm on, people are actually cancelling their new RV orders with Sprinter chassis because of this issue being that the issue is a BIG ongoing concern on these forums.
Misinformation is being given by the so-called "experts" as to anything over B5 causing major engine damage just by running one tank full.

Never fails to amaze me the naivete of some of these folks that believe all the b$%&^%t.....
So are you claiming that the statement that MB guidelines disallow biodiesel concentrations greater than B5 constitutes "misinformation"?

or

Are you including the engineers who designed the Sprinter in the list of 'so-called "experts"' that you deride?
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Old 06-26-2014, 10:22 PM   #7
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Default Re: Biodiesel - MB Sprinter Warranty

Quote:
Originally Posted by avanti
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobojay
You know on a couple of other forums I'm on, people are actually cancelling their new RV orders with Sprinter chassis because of this issue being that the issue is a BIG ongoing concern on these forums.
Misinformation is being given by the so-called "experts" as to anything over B5 causing major engine damage just by running one tank full.

Never fails to amaze me the naivete of some of these folks that believe all the b$%&^%t.....
So are you claiming that the statement that MB guidelines disallow biodiesel concentrations greater than B5 constitutes "misinformation"?

or

Are you including the engineers who designed the Sprinter in the list of 'so-called "experts"' that you deride?

What I'm saying is that the forum "experts" and alot of others are misinterpreting what MB is saying. Making too big of a deal out of the statements on the forums that one tankful of more than B5 is going to damage the engine. One tankful is not going to do anything harmful to the engine. It's continuous use that causes the damage. Just like continuous use of the non-compliant 229.51 required oil is going to damage the DPF immediately. Sure 229.51 needs to be used, but a couple thousand miles in an emergency is not going to do any long term damage there.

In any case, MB is going to have to change their requirements to the country they are selling in, not the other way around. Especially now that their 2 biggest euro van competitors now allow up to B20 in their diesels.
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Old 06-26-2014, 11:46 PM   #8
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Default Re: Biodiesel - MB Sprinter Warranty

I guess the question would be, "what if you lived in a state that mandated B20 so 50% or more of your fills were with B20"? Several of the questions on other boards were from folks that were looking at higher than B5 states, IIRC.
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Old 06-27-2014, 02:13 AM   #9
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Default Re: Biodiesel - MB Sprinter Warranty

Quote:
Originally Posted by booster
I guess the question would be, "what if you lived in a state that mandated B20 so 50% or more of your fills were with B20"? Several of the questions on other boards were from folks that were looking at higher than B5 states, IIRC.
Exactly!
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Old 06-27-2014, 02:10 PM   #10
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Default Re: Biodiesel - MB Sprinter Warranty

Colonel Jessup: You can't handle the truth!

Mercedes Benz has weighed in on it. Be cognizant of your oil levels and you should have no problems. Balancing your fills is just prudence, not a requirement.

Do you think a warranty is going to cover a gas engine if you abuse your engine? Dream on. Read the fine print of your warranties. They all have cover your ass clauses.

Until you start hearing on the forums of B owners having issues with B20, damage and warranty problems it is a Chicken Little issue. It ain't going to happen, IMO.
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