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Old 10-29-2016, 04:02 AM   #21
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Thanks!
I was able to order the alde heating system for the Zion. That's why I thought it would have the capacity to stay warm. Insulation may not be great but the space is quite small in a 21 foot van.
There are 2 ALDE systems...

the in-floor glycol radiant heating system as in the picture,

and

the ALDE force air system.
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Old 10-29-2016, 04:06 AM   #22
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Thanks for the feedback. The winter skiing gig is something I really haven't given a ton of thought to. A nice to have.

I assumed the heating could keep ahead of the cold. Even our tent trailer could keep warm on very cold nights. Its something I will definitely investigate further.

The tent trailer could keep warm, but you did not shower in it.


The next big challenge wintering in an RV is -- condensation.

It will drive you nuts.


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Old 10-29-2016, 04:44 AM   #23
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There are 2 ALDE systems...

the in-floor glycol radiant heating system as in the picture,

and

the ALDE force air system.
The system I bought was radiant heat in the floor. It was a pricy option. That I went for for comfort in cold weather. We have heated floors in our bathrooms at home and love the effect!
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Old 10-29-2016, 11:17 AM   #24
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The tent trailer could keep warm, but you did not shower in it.


The next big challenge wintering in an RV is -- condensation.

It will drive you nuts.


+1

If minus 20C or minus 30C outside then I'd anticipate that condensation to turn to ice inside the RV on windows and the inner sides of exposed sheet metal. A tent trailer would more allow the exchange of warm wet air inside with cold dry air from outside but you still have condensation issues with tent trailers.

Showering would dump a tremendous amount of humidity into the atmosphere in the van. If more moisture is introduced than the air temperature can support or if you allow the temperature in the van to drop that moisture will turn to condensation on cold surfaces.

Ideally you'd have a way to move air around in the van; in cabinets, under bunks etc. Moisture can form under foam mattresses if the space below the bed is cold. A controlled way to exchange some of the warm and relatively wet air inside by bringing in some cold dry air would be helpful in trying to manage the humidity level in the van.
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Old 10-29-2016, 12:35 PM   #25
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The system I bought was radiant heat in the floor. It was a pricy option. That I went for for comfort in cold weather. We have heated floors in our bathrooms at home and love the effect!
That's a new one. I thought the in-floor radiant heat is only available in the Sprinter.


Check this out

Part Eleven – A New Vehicle, New Questions – Class B Warned
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Old 10-29-2016, 01:40 PM   #26
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+1

Ideally you'd have a way to move air around in the van; in cabinets, under bunks etc. Moisture can form under foam mattresses if the space below the bed is cold. A controlled way to exchange some of the warm and relatively wet air inside by bringing in some cold dry air would be helpful in trying to manage the humidity level in the van.
I guess I am unusual but I keep warm by idling the van engine all night. I have the engine coolant piped down the center of the floor (floor heat) to the a rear radiator/evaporator. So the the dash heater brings in a controlled (dash fan speed) amount of dry air from the outside and heats it before bringing it into the van, while the rear radiator and floor pipes keeps the rear comfortable.

Simple but it works. I control the rear heat with a thermostat on the wall.
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Old 10-29-2016, 02:25 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by BBQ View Post
.

Regarding batteries...

in case you are not aware,


For Li-ion operations, most manufacturers recommend:

Charge temperature
0C to 45C (32F to 113F)

Discharge temperature
20C to 60C (4F to 140F)

The extreme allowable temperature for storage
40C to 50C (40C to 122F)


Tesla have built-in heater and cooler in their batteries.


Do you have a citation for the extreme allowable temperature for storage? Elite Power Solutions, the marketers for the GBS LiFePO4 batteries used by Technomadia, Advanced RV and others say -4F (-20C) to be the lowest allowable battery temperature for cold storage with external heat applied.

Also, for charging the optimum battery temperature should be above 41F (5C).

Mishandling at low temperatures can be fatal to the batteries. Mishandling at high temperatures might not be fatal but can diminish battery capacity. Technomadia, for instance described diminished capacity but not fatal abusing their batteries in high temperatures over 3.5 years in the Arizona summers.

In Minnesota I don't worry much about high temperatures but plan to keep my lithium ion batteries above 41F at all times.
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Old 10-29-2016, 03:34 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by DCHitt View Post
I guess I am unusual but I keep warm by idling the van engine all night. I have the engine coolant piped down the center of the floor (floor heat) to the a rear radiator/evaporator. So the the dash heater brings in a controlled (dash fan speed) amount of dry air from the outside and heats it before bringing it into the van, while the rear radiator and floor pipes keeps the rear comfortable.

Simple but it works. I control the rear heat with a thermostat on the wall.
Just thought I'd add a note here about CO (carbon monoxide) poisoning. This is not directed at DCHitt. I just mention it because some folks are not aware of the risk of death from CO (carbon monoxide) poisoning.

Apparently there's less risk with diesel engines than gas engines but everyone should do their own research.

Camper vans have additional holes in the body - some large enough to permit mice to enter apparently. Be careful & be safe.

A Ram Promaster manual has this bit of advice:

Quote:
Exhaust gases can injure or kill. They contain carbon
monoxide (CO), which is colorless and odorless.
Breathing it can make you unconscious and can
eventually poison you. To avoid breathing (CO),
follow these safety tips:
Do not run the engine in a closed garage or in
confined areas any longer than needed to move
your vehicle in or out of the area.
If you are required to drive with the trunk/liftgate/
rear doors open, make sure that all windows are
closed and the climate control BLOWER switch is
set at high speed. DO NOT use the recirculation
mode.
If it is necessary to sit in a parked vehicle with the
engine running, adjust your heating or cooling
controls to force outside air into the vehicle. Set the
blower at high speed.
I just felt obligated to mention this for anyone who is not aware of the risk of CO poisoning.
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Old 10-29-2016, 04:15 PM   #29
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Just thought I'd add a note here about CO (carbon monoxide) poisoning. This is not directed at DCHitt. I just mention it because some folks are not aware of the risk of death from CO (carbon monoxide) poisoning.

Apparently there's less risk with diesel engines than gas engines but everyone should do their own research.

Camper vans have additional holes in the body - some large enough to permit mice to enter apparently. Be careful & be safe.

A Ram Promaster manual has this bit of advice:

I just felt obligated to mention this for anyone who is not aware of the risk of CO poisoning.
Good advice, My van came with a CO alarm and I carry a second one that gives a display with the amount of CO even when it is below the alarm level.

My experience with an Onan carries the same warnings. I had alarms go off with the Onan when no wind was blowing or was blowing in the wrong direction. Even though I was heating with Propane the Onan was required because the heater fan was running all the time.

My Promaster brings air in from the front and goes through a filter. The CO is exiting from the rear. If I have a choice, I sit with the front of the van into the wind.
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Old 10-29-2016, 04:39 PM   #30
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I think the Zion is a fine choice but most if not all RV manufacturers use the bare minimum insulation. Your heating will be on at all times in below freezing temps. Also, no RV manufacturers use double pane or insulated windows. This is where all your heat loss comes from. We have a promaster and cut two layers of reflectix for the side windows, which helps but is only around R-2. Hardly enough to stop heat loss. We have tank heaters and I just ordered heat tape for the water lines but I do not believe it is enough for extended below-freezing camping. I will be interested in your progress. Please keep us posted.
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