Don't understand the Li3 System

[jim9706]

We just bought our first RV, a used 2020 Coachmen Galleria Li3. Unfortunately, the dealer (Lazydays Mesa, AZ) didn't do a good job of explaining the RV when we picked it up.

Specifically, I have questions about the Battery/Inverter/Solar system.
1. I plugged into power at home and charged the batteries overnight. Today the solar panel says "Full" and the Xantrax panel shows 4 bars, but it also shows 61% and 327AH. This is 600AH system.
2. When I turn on the disconnect with nothing on in the coach I have a battery draw of 4AH. This is with the solar in full sun and fridge and everything else off. When I turn off the disconnect then a get a positive AMP reading of about 4-5.

This is very confusing to me. Is this normal or should I be looking for something that is drawing power?

[Boxster1971]

Is the inverter ON?

[jim9706]

Originally Posted by Boxster1971

Is the inverter ON?

Yes the inverter is on.

[@Michael]

4A parasitic draw with the inverter on might be normal? Not sure.

AFAIK, the propane value draws close to an amp, the propane detector draws a half-amp, the various displays, control panels and electronics might draw a half or full amp, and an idling inverter draws some current too.

I'd trust the Xantrax panel over the solar charger.

--Mike

[jim9706]

I'm still not sure why the batteries won't charge to 100%?

[@Michael]

Unfortunately I'm not familiar with that specific system.

If it's what I think it is, it'll charge from shore power and when running the engine. I'd start by plugging it into shore power, and making sure the Xantrex is charging the battery. I'd also run the engine and see if that charges the battery. Either should charge at more than 50A.

Do you know what model Xantrex they used? That might help locate proper manuals.

[booster]

The solar is probably going right to float based on the battery voltage, which is way too common with the lithium batteries and solar.


Take a look and see if the solar controller tells you what stage it is in and you will know for sure.


It is going to float you will have to see if you can change settings to keep it from doing that. On some controllers you can and on others you can't. If float is 13.4v of so it will be charging very, very slowly.


Also, don't believe the battery monitor if you don't know the the last time it recalibrated by getting the proper amps and volts reading to do that reset. Monitors that you read when you got the van could be way, way, way off depending on how the van was used and how well the monitor and charging are setup.


All of the charging sources have to be set right, as does the monitor for you to get good charging and good information about battery state of charge.

[jim9706]

I plugged in and then took it on the road and it charged to 100%. Thank you. I see that if I turn off the battery disconnect there are 0amps being used, but it looks like the solar is still charging.

[dmb496]

jim9706,

Check your private messages, as I sent you one regarding the Li3 issue.

[Jacbaird]

Originally Posted by dmb496

jim9706,

Check your private messages, as I sent you one regarding the Li3 issue.

What is the “LI3 issue”? I don’t seem to be able to charge from shore (with no indicator light on either) and assumed it is a fuse. Then again, it seemed to charge after driving around for a bit and the indicator light came on when I plugged in. Hmmmmm….

[Jhv2]

I don’t think dmb was referring to a general Li3 issue.

Please give more specifics about yours. What model/year? What is “the indicator light”?

Do you have access to the xantrex app? I had a no charging on shore power issue. It was caused by my charger being set to sync with the ignition. There is a setting in the battery inverter/charger control (much easier to get to with the app). Look for "charger ignition control" and make sure it is set to off not auto.

[Boxster1971]

Originally Posted by dmb496

jim9706,

Check your private messages, as I sent you one regarding the Li3 issue.

Private messages on this sort of topic don’t help others much. Please share your issue.

[dmb496]

Originally Posted by Boxster1971

Private messages on this sort of topic don’t help others much. Please share your issue.

I steered the OP to several forums for possible answers to his multiple questions. Those sources include many owners of a class B that have the Li3 system.

I advised the OP that I don't have the Li3 system and couldn't offer specific help.

[Boxster1971]

Originally Posted by dmb496

I steered the OP to several forums for possible answers to his multiple questions. Those sources include many owners of a class B that have the Li3 system.

I advised the OP that I don't have the Li3 system and couldn't offer specific help.

Perhaps more of us would like to know more about the Li3 system if they are looking at Coachman B-vans. I've found that some Facebook (FB) private groups are very closed to those of us just looking for more information from current owners. I tried to join the GrechRV group and never received a response. I guess because I don't own a GrechRV?

I was able to join the Airstream Interstate and Storyteller FB groups to learn more about the Volta battery system before I bought my Interstate 19 with the Volta battery.

[dmb496]

Originally Posted by Boxster1971

Perhaps more of us would like to know more about the Li3 system if they are looking at Coachman B-vans. I've found that some Facebook (FB) private groups are very closed to those of us just looking for more information from current owners. I tried to join the GrechRV group and never received a response. I guess because I don't own a GrechRV?

I was able to join the Airstream Interstate and Storyteller FB groups to learn more about the Volta battery system before I bought my Interstate 19 with the Volta battery.

The 2 groups I recommended to the OP are dedicated to Coachmen-built class B's. Lots of info in those groups and so many members are able and willing to help out others in need.

I'm not familiar with any FB forums for Airstream class B's.

The Li3 is a comprehensive system, but a pricey option. I re-worked nearly all the cables on a friend's Li3 system, and had to used the expertise of another individual for resetting some of the software parameters. Of course that one repair doesn't make me an expert on the Li3 system.

I ordered our Galleria with the AGM battery house system, with the intention of converting and building my own lithium system. I did the upgrade and created a lithium system with a bit more than twice the amp hours of the Li3 system, and invested just 65% of the Li3's cost. It was an intense project that I truly enjoyed from start to finish. DIY can be rewarding for several reasons if it's within your ability.

[Jhv2]

Li3 owner here (although newer model)
Don’t concern yourself with the solar controller it is well known to not be a good match with the Lithionics batteries.
And yes the inverter being on will draw down the battery. You only need the inverter on when using 110 appliances. The xantrex charger will work if inverter is off.

One key point is that the solar (and the inverter to some extent) are trying to report on battery state via voltage, which is an outdated concept for lithium. You should have a lithionics display with shutdown button. Toggling through its options is the best place to see state of charge. Also the phone app is great for this.

As you have discovered the most effective way to charge the battery is by driving.

[JoeM]

I have a Coachmen Nova Li3 system. I was told by folks at the factory that if you are charging from home you should use a 120 volt 30Amp circuit. 15 Amp standard house hold circuit may cause some problems with charging. My understanding is it can unbalance the cells in the battery. I am assuming you have a Lithionics battery. I installed a 30 Amp breaker in my house main panel and ran a line out to the garage. I can park the van outside of the garage if I need to charge.

[booster]

Originally Posted by JoeM

I have a Coachmen Nova Li3 system. I was told by folks at the factory that if you are charging from home you should use a 120 volt 30Amp circuit. 15 Amp standard house hold circuit may cause some problems with charging. My understanding is it can unbalance the cells in the battery. I am assuming you have a Lithionics battery. I installed a 30 Amp breaker in my house main panel and ran a line out to the garage. I can park the van outside of the garage if I need to charge.

I don't understand the 30 amp circuit being needed as it appears you would have a 3000 watt Xantrex inverter/charger which is shown on the Xntrex site as having a 100amp DC charger. They do also so it is a 3000/150 so some spec may be wrong. A 100 amp charger usually runs at just under 15 amps of AC and some more on starting surge but that usually doesn't require bigger service. Our 100 amp DC Magnum charger can run fine on a 15 amp circuit. If you really need 30 amps to charge the batteries properly how are you going to camp and charge on shore power? You would have no power left for anything else like cooking, etc unless it load sheds which would again, if they are correct, affect battery balance.


It all makes absolutely no sense to me.

[Jhv2]

Originally Posted by booster

I don't understand the 30 amp circuit being needed

The 30 amp recommendation is overstated. The concern is that if on 15 amp circuit you are using some of that power there may be a reduced output of the charger during float stage so that it does not have enough voltage for enough time.

It does not need all 30 amps. If hooked to 15 amps and nothing else is using inverter/charger power it will do ok.

Secondly this balancing is only needed if you have consecutively run up and down your batteries over a period of time. The Lithionics app can show you the exact levels of each cell so you can check if you are even approaching an unbalanced state, and then take measures as needed.

For simplest sake for those who don’t want to understand why, just hook to 30 amp every two weeks. -- therefore the oft quoted recomendation.

[dmb496]

Originally Posted by booster

I don't understand the 30 amp circuit being needed as it appears you would have a 3000 watt Xantrex inverter/charger which is shown on the Xntrex site as having a 100amp DC charger. They do also so it is a 3000/150 so some spec may be wrong. A 100 amp charger usually runs at just under 15 amps of AC and some more on starting surge but that usually doesn't require bigger service. Our 100 amp DC Magnum charger can run fine on a 15 amp circuit. If you really need 30 amps to charge the batteries properly how are you going to camp and charge on shore power? You would have no power left for anything else like cooking, etc unless it load sheds which would again, if they are correct, affect battery balance.


It all makes absolutely no sense to me.

My system uses a Xantrex XC Pro 3000 watt inverter/charger. It will charge the battery perfectly when connected to a 120 volt 15 amp duplex outlet IF the software for the incoming amperage setting in the Xantrex is changed to 15 amps input.