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Old 11-26-2014, 11:33 AM   #41
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model...

I'd guess 180Ah at 3.2V size too. So either 360Ah at 12v or 180Ah at 24v per box.

It's difficult to figure out the configuration as the battery layouts don't look to be the same in all of the 4 boxes in the video. The buss bars in 2 boxes look to go across 4 neg-posts then 4 poss+ posts which I think would be 24 volts.

Just my guess though ............

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Old 11-26-2014, 12:40 PM   #42
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model...

I have to guess also, but I think it would be 6 volts in that box if it is 4 cells parallel two places and then those two groups in series with the minus and plus together. So maybe 4 X 180 = 720AH at 6.4 volts?
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Old 11-26-2014, 12:59 PM   #43
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model...

it's cool how everybody has different insights-i took the pictures as just being intiially charging and were wired so all cells would get the same charge.
the final wiring would come later.


the inverter on this model is going to be 2000 watts so my best guess is they will be wired into 2 12 volt batteries-amps though are the specualation


answer-all of the above-by building their lithium banks this way they can make 24 volt or 12 volt to feed different in make and size 24 volt, or 12 volt inverters or inverter/chargers
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Old 11-27-2014, 08:06 PM   #44
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model...

Quote:
Originally Posted by gerrym51
Wincrasher -you keep talking about tank sizes. tell me what size tanks and what B van has tank sizes you like that has all 3 things
That's the thing, Gerry, I don't know of any Promaster van that has it all. In that size van, you have to give up something.

Ideally, I'd like a Promaster based van that has 30-40 gallon fresh water tank, 25-30 grey tank, and a 12-15 gallon black. On top of that, I'd like 12-18 gallons of propane. A generator. A battery bank with 4 group 31 batteries and 600 watts of solar. Along with air conditioner, furnace and a big fridge.

I also like the front lounge layout as I've shown in the Shire, but that layout in the Safari condo is appealing too.

This van is a unicorn, I guess, at least on this small platform. I'm just saying you're hard pressed to "have it all" and invariably have to give up some items to get the rest of what you want.
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Old 11-27-2014, 09:55 PM   #45
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model...

Quote:
Originally Posted by wincrasher
Quote:
Originally Posted by gerrym51
Wincrasher -you keep talking about tank sizes. tell me what size tanks and what B van has tank sizes you like that has all 3 things
That's the thing, Gerry, I don't know of any Promaster van that has it all. In that size van, you have to give up something.

Ideally, I'd like a Promaster based van that has 30-40 gallon fresh water tank, 25-30 grey tank, and a 12-15 gallon black. On top of that, I'd like 12-18 gallons of propane. A generator. A battery bank with 4 group 31 batteries and 600 watts of solar. Along with air conditioner, furnace and a big fridge.

I also like the front lounge layout as I've shown in the Shire, but that layout in the Safari condo is appealing too.

This van is a unicorn, I guess, at least on this small platform. I'm just saying you're hard pressed to "have it all" and invariably have to give up some items to get the rest of what you want.

your right-what you want is a unicorn in a b. even full length sprinter B's can' t handle all that
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Old 11-27-2014, 11:09 PM   #46
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model...

Quote:
Originally Posted by gerrym51
Quote:
Originally Posted by wincrasher
Quote:
Originally Posted by gerrym51
Wincrasher -you keep talking about tank sizes. tell me what size tanks and what B van has tank sizes you like that has all 3 things
That's the thing, Gerry, I don't know of any Promaster van that has it all. In that size van, you have to give up something.

Ideally, I'd like a Promaster based van that has 30-40 gallon fresh water tank, 25-30 grey tank, and a 12-15 gallon black. On top of that, I'd like 12-18 gallons of propane. A generator. A battery bank with 4 group 31 batteries and 600 watts of solar. Along with air conditioner, furnace and a big fridge.

I also like the front lounge layout as I've shown in the Shire, but that layout in the Safari condo is appealing too.

This van is a unicorn, I guess, at least on this small platform. I'm just saying you're hard pressed to "have it all" and invariably have to give up some items to get the rest of what you want.

your right-what you want is a unicorn in a b. even full length sprinter B's can' t handle all that
That's news to me.
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Old 11-30-2014, 07:10 AM   #47
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model...

Seeing all these upfits makes me wonder what RT is going to do. 400 watts of solar would be extremely useful, and if RT puts in a system that separates the electrical stuff from the power generation source (similar to using a Magnum Energy or Victron hybrid inverter), this could provide some very useful boondocking abilities.

Of course, there is always price. If I'm going to pay north of $100,000.00 for a rig, I might as well either buy something on a Sprinter chassis that has a known resale value. The RT SS Agile is quite a known quantity, and even though it doesn't have the engine generator option, it is still the market standard that other 19-21 foot "B"s measure with, similar with the RT RS Adventurous at the 22 foot mark.
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Old 11-30-2014, 01:07 PM   #48
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model...

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Originally Posted by mlts22
Seeing all these upfits makes me wonder what RT is going to do. 400 watts of solar would be extremely useful, and if RT puts in a system that separates the electrical stuff from the power generation source (similar to using a Magnum Energy or Victron hybrid inverter), this could provide some very useful boondocking abilities.

Of course, there is always price. If I'm going to pay north of $100,000.00 for a rig, I might as well either buy something on a Sprinter chassis that has a known resale value. The RT SS Agile is quite a known quantity, and even though it doesn't have the engine generator option, it is still the market standard that other 19-21 foot "B"s measure with, similar with the RT RS Adventurous at the 22 foot mark.
I have been trying to discern in advance and don't know. the reason i am not sure is the the second alternator option for the promaster does not seem to exist. chrysler doesn't offer one and there seems to be no outside provider that makes a second alternator bracket for the pentastar yet.

the standard alternator on the promaster is 180 amps and a 220 amps is orderable . however no second alternator which roadtrek uses in the e-trek and 1/2 e-trek options. nationsalternators does sell a 270 amp alternator that replaces the current promasters alternator.

without the high output 2nd alternator i would think there are some limitations

however lithium iron phophate batteries charge faster and can be easily used over and over down to 20 percent and don't ever need to be fully charged and they take one hundred percent of the solar collected. it does change the calculus to a great degree from AGM's

by the way-the 'engine generator' is now available on the Agile. build one on roadtreks site-you do have to get upgrade to 6 liter engine though-not available on the 4.
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Old 11-30-2014, 02:18 PM   #49
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model...

Quote:
Originally Posted by gerrym51
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlts22
Seeing all these upfits makes me wonder what RT is going to do. 400 watts of solar would be extremely useful, and if RT puts in a system that separates the electrical stuff from the power generation source (similar to using a Magnum Energy or Victron hybrid inverter), this could provide some very useful boondocking abilities.

Of course, there is always price. If I'm going to pay north of $100,000.00 for a rig, I might as well either buy something on a Sprinter chassis that has a known resale value. The RT SS Agile is quite a known quantity, and even though it doesn't have the engine generator option, it is still the market standard that other 19-21 foot "B"s measure with, similar with the RT RS Adventurous at the 22 foot mark.
I have been trying to discern in advance and don't know. the reason i am not sure is the the second alternator option for the promaster does not seem to exist. chrysler doesn't offer one and there seems to be no outside provider that makes a second alternator bracket for the pentastar yet.

the standard alternator on the promaster is 180 amps and a 220 amps is orderable . however no second alternator which roadtrek uses in the e-trek and 1/2 e-trek options. nationsalternators does sell a 270 amp alternator that replaces the current promasters alternator.

without the high output 2nd alternator i would think there are some limitations

however lithium iron phophate batteries charge faster and can be easily used over and over down to 20 percent and don't ever need to be fully charged and they take one hundred percent of the solar collected. it does change the calculus to a great degree from AGM's

by the way-the 'engine generator' is now available on the Agile. build one on roadtreks site-you do have to get upgrade to 6 liter engine though-not available on the 4.
There is one thing that I think folks may want to keep in mind on the engine generator thing. All they are is a big alternator, sometimes at a higher voltage, so unless you have separate, non connected, double charging systems there is not really any significant difference between a big single and two alternators. Of course that assumes you can get the capacity you need.

How many amps you need from the engine charging system is also something that changed in my mind recently after a discussion with Lifeline about charging rates of AGM batteries. For us, and probably most(?) folks, charging the batteries turns out to be the highest amp draw you will need from the engine. The traditional information that I had heard is that you can charge AGM batteries at a very high rate, some saying C/2 some saying even at above C (AH of capacity).

Now they say you should stick to the "preferred" rates for charging, which are C/4 for lifeline and C/5 for Fullriver AGM batteries, which changes everything. At C/4, 600AH of batteries would only need 150 amps MAXIMUM of charge rate. Wet cells are even lower at C/11 for Trojan.

Our microwave pulls about 75 amps if the voltage is above 13.2 or so. Add that to the max charge rate for 600AH of batteries, and a single 250 amp alternator could run both at the same time without issue.

Of course, all this goes out the window if you have lithium batteries, which can take huge charge rates, or if you are willing to take the hit on battery like with AGMs and charge them at higher rates (they will accept the rate, but it is hard on them).

IMO, if you have AGM batteries, or wet cells, and don't run anything that pulls over 100 amps by itself, and 250 or 300 amp single alternator will do just fine. You would only need more if you wanted to run the coach air conditioner, and you could just run the van AC instead since the engine is running anyway.

If you do go shopping for a big single alternator for any application, be sure to check the entire output curve. Many times, when they increase the max output (great while going down the road), they lose, or stay the same, on idle output (won't run the microwave at idle without pulling from the batteries). There are some alternators that do both better. Denso based alternators are ones that do both well, in most cases. High output rewound factory case units are usually not very good at idle.

I do wonder if the lithium batteries are going to find their way into the lower cost Promaster Bs in the near future, as it would probably take some customers away from the better margin vehicles on the high end of the scale. If you don't have lithium batteries, or a 12v to 12v charger, getting the 3500 watt alternator would probably shorten the life of you batteries due to higher than desired charge rates.
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Old 11-30-2014, 02:45 PM   #50
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model...

Roadtreks second alternator is a 280 amp one-this is in the sprinter. this combined with the sprinters standard 220 gives a lot of amps.

it just does not appear that the promaster will have that option unless roadtrek fabricates it itself-which i don't think they ever have. the Chevy's have this option(the 6.0) but nationsalternator-i assume there are others-makes a chevy 6.0 second alternator device


the e-trek full package requires the equivelent of 8 6 volt agm's.

the promaster could employ a semi-half e-trek-no high output second alternator. i will be pissed if no available lithium option on promaster.

I WILL be buying a roadtrek in first quarter of 2015 and i am determined to get lithium
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Old 11-30-2014, 04:06 PM   #51
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model...

Quote:
Originally Posted by gerrym51
Roadtreks second alternator is a 280 amp one-this is in the sprinter. this combined with the sprinters standard 220 gives a lot of amps.

it just does not appear that the promaster will have that option unless roadtrek fabricates it itself-which i don't think they ever have. the Chevy's have this option(the 6.0) but nationsalternator-i assume there are others-makes a chevy 6.0 second alternator device


the e-trek full package requires the equivelent of 8 6 volt agm's.

the promaster could employ a semi-half e-trek-no high output second alternator. i will be pissed if no available lithium option on promaster.

I WILL be buying a roadtrek in first quarter of 2015 and i am determined to get lithium
With lithium, you will have no limits on high end amps as long as they control it well. I hope you can get them. The 8 AGMs in the etrek package must be the 1600AH they advertise that is really 800AH at 12v. Still unanswered is if they have any charging limiting or cutoff when full to protect the AGMs. They should only charge at 320 amps maximum per Lifeline, and there would theoretically have 500 amps available. The 4 battery setup, which I think also has the same generator would be even more over amped.
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Old 11-30-2014, 04:34 PM   #52
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model...

Quote:
Originally Posted by booster
Quote:
Originally Posted by gerrym51
Roadtreks second alternator is a 280 amp one-this is in the sprinter. this combined with the sprinters standard 220 gives a lot of amps.

it just does not appear that the promaster will have that option unless roadtrek fabricates it itself-which i don't think they ever have. the Chevy's have this option(the 6.0) but nationsalternator-i assume there are others-makes a chevy 6.0 second alternator device


the e-trek full package requires the equivelent of 8 6 volt agm's.

the promaster could employ a semi-half e-trek-no high output second alternator. i will be pissed if no available lithium option on promaster.

I WILL be buying a roadtrek in first quarter of 2015 and i am determined to get lithium
With lithium, you will have no limits on high end amps as long as they control it well. I hope you can get them. The 8 AGMs in the etrek package must be the 1600AH they advertise that is really 800AH at 12v. Still unanswered is if they have any charging limiting or cutoff when full to protect the AGMs. They should only charge at 320 amps maximum per Lifeline, and there would theoretically have 500 amps available. The 4 battery setup, which I think also has the same generator would be even more over amped.

I actually asked Jim Hammill if the eight lithium cells in the video were 180 amp cells his words were 'wrong' but he also said proprietary. assuming they are 180 amp cells one of these boxes is 360 amps at 12 volt. 2 would be needed in an e-trek. i'm hoping i can get 1 in the promaster or 190.

i'm determined to hold out for lithium. if i buy an agm one and 3 months later they start selling lithium i would go gaga. i might actually try to get the lithium as a special order from roadtrek. it depends on Jim Hammils mood and on what day.
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Old 12-03-2014, 03:33 AM   #53
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model...

the roadtrek zion




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Old 12-03-2014, 04:04 AM   #54
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Default roadtrek promaster 'zion'

roadtrek zion


http://roadtreking.com/010-roadtreking- ... motorhome/
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Old 12-03-2014, 03:58 PM   #55
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model...

Quote:
Originally Posted by gerrym51
[youtube:221n1au8]9tegQk6NSPo[/youtube:221n1au8]

What do you think Gerry? Do you like it better than the Ranger?
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Old 12-03-2014, 04:08 PM   #56
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model...

Quote:
Originally Posted by markopolo
Quote:
Originally Posted by gerrym51
[youtube:1gq1jc51]9tegQk6NSPo[/youtube:1gq1jc51]

What do you think Gerry? Do you like it better than the Ranger?

Marko-i need more info and facts but so far yes-i do like it better-but i don't know everything about it

the bathroom might be issue for the wife but better inverter/charger location than other roadtreks
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Old 12-03-2014, 04:25 PM   #57
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

Lots of easily accessible interior storage
Very little counter space (shown in video) yes, I noticed the flip up but it is low.
Nice big 5 cu ft fridge

I don't see the need for the rear power sofa in that twin bed config.
200 watts solar option
2000 watt inverter
400ah battery but voltage wasn't mentioned. Roadtrek has used 6v and 12v in the past for advertising battery capacity.

I'd like to see the drivers seat rotated as the bathroom wall looks to be close.
I wonder where all the tanks are?
Anyone know if an Onan generator is an option?

Around $82,000 MSRP depending on options makes it competitively priced.
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Old 12-03-2014, 04:47 PM   #58
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

Quote:
Originally Posted by markopolo
Lots of easily accessible interior storage
Very little counter space (shown in video) yes, I noticed the flip up but it is low.
Nice big 5 cu ft fridge

I don't see the need for the rear power sofa in that twin bed config.
200 watts solar option
2000 watt inverter
400ah battery but voltage wasn't mentioned. Roadtrek has used 6v and 12v in the past for advertising battery capacity.

I'd like to see the drivers seat rotated as the bathroom wall looks to be close.
I wonder where all the tanks are?
Anyone know if an Onan generator is an option?

Around $82,000 MSRP depending on options makes it competitively priced.

the table and bolster on the passenger side bed enable one big bed for 3 people. jim hammil said seats 5 sleeps 3.

my opinion NO onan-prefer a spare tire under van.

remember the most expensive part of these vans(all roadtreks) is after the van LABOR is the most cost. because there is nothing after the cab(everything is up fornt) other than the spare there is open space-easier and less expensive to build

in the video jim hammill talks about 280 amp alternator-he does not say if this is the 2nd alternator or original replacement. this is going to be the partial e-trek package. no Onan i think
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Old 12-03-2014, 05:29 PM   #59
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

If you can get 400ah at 12V in batteries, 200 watts solar, 2000 watt inverter/charger and 280 amp alternator I see no reason for an Onan generator. I pretty much satisfied myself on that matter. It will do everything but run an air conditioner for any "appreciable length of time" other than maybe a lunch stop with pet on board.

I'll say it again. If you run a generator under your bed to run an air conditioner over your head you are doing something terribly wrong in your pleasure seeking. If you absolutely have to run that air conditioning, cut your misery in half and seek shore power.
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Old 12-03-2014, 06:16 PM   #60
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Default Re: Roadtrek is making a ProMaster model... Zion

other than the 170 all models currently get 6 volt combinations. if he is talking about the normal 1/2 trek package it's 4 6 volt batteries that have a total of 220 12 volt amps.he has said that things are different on this from other roadtreks so i could be wrong.

I am still holding out hope that i can get the 360 amp lithium package that they showed in prior video

still need more info.
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